has anyone had any luck with a lawyer.

[#1]

my Pipeworkpieces shop was forced into vacation mode like a lot of you since Wed with no reply from etsy support. 

As we all know as soon as we are put into this forced vacation mode we lose chat support from our dashboard which is unfair when you think of all the fees we pay Etsy in a year. I know I have paid them over 15k so far this year and to be treated like this is so unfair.

Etsy is my only source of income as people do not find my own website so I rely on Etsy.

Now I am wondering if anyone has ever gotten a lawyer or gone to the public media about these forced vacation closures for no valid reason ?

I would understand if we broke Etsy policy BUT when a STAR seller (We work hard to reach this status) gets put into forced vacation mode for no valid reason if we have legal recourse for loss of income. (I did see a message that Etsy said my business number was not showing in my shop which was not true as when I went to look at Etsy legal documents in my account it was there and even said verified)

So with the millions Etsy spends on advertising what if people were to start going to the media about how Etsy treats there star sellers that make Etsy the money to spend on advertising.

RANT mode over - JUST so frustrated no one from Etsy helps us when this happens.

Is it a human who pulls the switch or an algorithm of some sort with no intervention.

Since I now know the etsy mods see these posts from all of us and lock it with an apology so no one can communicate about this.

Wonder what happened to the law about free speech and expression !

Anyway my profile is on my post here please feel free to direct message me.

[pipeworkpieces]

thank you so much for your awesome reply. I will certainly look into this matter. And I have not been late on any orders even with an increase BUT I only have 22 orders in my queue so I do not believe this is the issue. My business number could be as you mentioned I have a number like Canada Business Number 729***476 they never clarified they want my incorporation number which I will reach out yet again and ask them if this is the issue.,

[michellepatterns]

22 open orders is a lot of open orders--especially with recent Canada postal issues, Christmas in just over a week, etsy's offer to buyers to refund late arriving shipments.  

I'd second that this might be an open order issue.  The part about them "reviewing your info" might read to you as reviewing your business info but it could also mean something like "we are watching the information about your open orders".  

[pipeworkpieces]

@PrairiePrimitives not LLC but a corporation incorporated in Quebec Canada.

And even though I can edit or append to the etsy vacation message I am in fact still on vacation mode.

But not fair they still renew automaticly my products and charge my account where they have frozen all my funds now.

[PrairiePrimitives]

@pipeworkpieces Ohh! Sorry, I didn't check on your location first.

I think freezing your funds and automatic renewal are 2 different processes. However, if they're automatically renewing your listings while your shop is on forced vacation, that is NOT cool. 

Can you access your listings in the shop manager, as in edit them if you were so inclined? Can you turn off the automatic renewal for the time being? 

[pipeworkpieces]

@PrairiePrimitives so sad just read the terms mentioned in the link you shared to me

We May Discontinue the Services Etsy reserves the right to change, suspend, or discontinue any of the Services for you, any or all users, at any time, for any reason, including those laid out in Etsy’s policies under these Terms of Use. We will not be liable to you for the effect that any changes to the Services may have on you, including your income or your ability to generate revenue through the Services.

Survival. The Terms will remain in effect even after your access to the Service is terminated, or your use of the Service ends.

[PoochandTabby]

Based on Etsy's message about the verification of documents, it appears that is the issue, no?

We've also been told that we have to add our SIN numbers in Canada since the summer, which is a CRA requirement now for selling on any marketplace. Do you have that noted in your account?

https://help.etsy.com/hc/en-us/articles/25255013479703-What-Information-Does-Etsy-Report-for-Canadia...

There were threads a few months ago from a couple corporations that were placed on vacation mode having to do with their UBO document/info. Do you have that uploaded already?

Bringing a lawyer into the mix probably isn't wise if you want to keep your Etsy shop. I have no doubt they'd terminate your account for any type of legal intervention against them. 

Going through this situation should be proof enough to never rely on one place for your income. Now is the time to promote your actual website because at any time, Etsy can shut any seller down.

ETA: Star seller only saves you from being placed on a reserve, not on vacation mode.

[EnchantedWhispersArt]

Do you know where we are supposed to enter our SIN? I only have the line for my GST?HST # which is filled but I don't see anywhere to add a SIN #?

[pipeworkpieces]

@PrairiePrimitives I agree not cool they are renewing listings as they expire automatically and taking money from my funds that are frozen.

@PoochandTabby I guess you are right I guess bringing in a lawyer would get my shop shut down. It just miffs me they are stating something about my payment account yet they were direct depositing 2-4k a week into my account with no problems and getting the referral fees they charge at the same time.

[pipeworkpieces]

@PrairiePrimitives yes I can edit any listing . I already decided to lower the amount of listings I sell here and focus on more of the items being sold on my own website. But I still have close to 300 items I can make and are on Etsy for now.

[PrairiePrimitives]

@pipeworkpieces Do you sell on eBay? I'd say that's worth a try! My sales there seem to go in cycles but as long as I keep listing things (or at least "being active" with my listings there), I usually get an order or two each week. Not very exciting but, at this point, it all helps. 

This week I've been catching up with listing the same stuff there that I have here. As soon as I sell something on one site, I immediately check the other site to deactivate it there if it's listed there. If you're able to make the same things repeatedly (so they're not OOAK), then you wouldn't need to bother with this step! 

The only other site I'd maybe recommend would be Amazon Handmade. It didn't work for me but it does seem to work well for other sellers, especially those who can make repetitive items. 

[pipeworkpieces]

@PrairiePrimitives I am on ebay as well as my own website. Amazon handmade never worked for me I had my most popular floating and raised dog food feeders as well as my pet food bins and some of my most unique toilet paper stands and maybe sold two items in one year. So I got off of that platform. I do have over 100 items on my ebay shop pipeworkpieces but have not seen an order come in in one year

I pretty much need to find the money to hire a google professional to do advertising to get good clients to my own website.

[PrairiePrimitives]

@pipeworkpieces Work on your SEO, both for Etsy & eBay. Ask for a shop critique in that forum! 

On eBay are you using item specifics? If not, add those ASAP!!! And if you're not using their promoted listings, give that a try. Right now, I'm taking a break from promoted listings ... hoping to send eBay's algorithm a message that I think they're overpriced; when I use them at a level that actually works, it doubles my FVF (so it's close to 25%), and that's too damnnnn much! As it is, my eBay prices are a bit higher than on Etsy because their basic FVF is 3% or so more than Etsy ... and also because I send offers on eBay trying to drum up business. 

[pipeworkpieces]

on a side note I wonder why the mods have not locked my thread yet lol

[Beadboat1]

This just happened to me today. I am one of the largest sellers on Etsy by the way. It is so stressful to deal with this. Great timing too.

[pipeworkpieces]

OMG 2,069,836 Sales and a star seller to boot and they did this to you. Thats totally insane !!

[pipeworkpieces]

@Beadboat1 makes no sense to me. Etsy itself is losing money off of us by doing this how can they rationalize doing this ? I am small potatoes compared to your situation but still they will lose money off my lost sales .

[Beadboat1]

@pipeworkpieces I searched the forums and there are like 50 posts about this this week. Seems like it's happening to a lot of people.

[PrairiePrimitives]

@Beadboat1 Some days it feels like there are 50 posts about this per day! 

[SonnenFelsCrystal]

Etsy is undoubtedly a rigorous platform, but it is VERY UNUSUAL for such a MASSIVE WAVE of bans to occur. From January 2024 to November 2024, there were around 40 threads about forced vacation mode. However, in the past two days alone, the number has exceeded 40 enormously.

This situation is in stark contrast to the benefit of both Etsy and its sellers, so I don't believe anyone from Etsy did it manually. I am also a Machine Learning Engineer, what I can imagine is - there might be data metrics drift in the data flow or they launched an untested and exploded risk model without any greyscale testing skipping all adequate procedure.

This is a CATASTROPHE, especially during the critical holiday season.

[PrairiePrimitives]

@SonnenFelsCrystal Although I don't entirely understand what you wrote, I think something may not have gone as planned. 

I remember hearing/reading (years ago) that anyone at Etsy was allowed, even encouraged, to launch their own tests. This was when I came to the conclusion there was probably a lack of internal communication ... which could have prevented  mishaps when one person's testing didn't play nice with someone else's testing. It's just a theory because I'm not techy enough to know what's actually possible or if there are any safeguards in place to prevent a total meltdown.

[CoquetteBath]

you're confusing free speech with free speech...LOL.

the idea of free speech is that someone can say something against the government and NOT go to jail. That wasn't the case back when the US was founded...people disagreed with King George and it was to the prison they went.

so that's one of our founding rights in the US. It does not mean that you have the right to say anything that you want, any time that you want...the example is yelling fire in a crowded theater. You do that. You're liable for the damages of anyone who was injured or worse...

so, that's one thing.

does Etsy have a fiduciary duty to us, however, is the main question. They do to their shareholders, of course, but do that to us? I think that they SHOULD (which means that they really consider and care about how we are and what is going on) but I'm going to say that they do not (at least not to the level I feel that they should).

A lawyer may be able to get some precedent in that area for you. But if you've got the millions that will be needed to fight this, go for it. If not (and I surely do not...) then you do the best you can with what you have, where you are...until you cannot. I do commiserate with you, however. This is an awful time of year for anything like this.

[LaRenaissanceGirl]

@pipeworkpieces  You have a really beautiful shop. I have nothing helpful to add, I just wanted to say I'm sorry this happened to you -- a good seller. Etsy needs to pull their head out of you know where. Ugh. 

[PrairiePrimitives]

Nested in the wrong place. 

[IdleTymeCreations]

This just happened to me! 

Almost put me in tears as there is ABSOLUTELY NOT REASON FOR THIS! I will be losing money like so many others and probably customers! 

How many people does it take for a Class Action lawsuit?  Has ETSY BEEN HACKED? Is it AI?  

My shop message they put up is a lie to my customers!  The message I received is--- 

Your shop will stay in Vacation Mode while we review your info

This means you won't be able to receive new orders until we finish verifying your info (which usually takes up to 48 hours after you uploaded your document). No need to do anything else right now—we'll reach out if we need more details from you.

If this is not fixed immediately, I won't have any customers let for the Christmas holiday rush.

Sorry for the rant... 

[PrairiePrimitives]

@IdleTymeCreations Etsy sellers in North & South America can't participate in class action lawsuits against Etsy. 

Read paragraph 11.b.

https://www.etsy.com/legal/terms-of-use#arbitrationagreement