Bestseller deranked

[KanjaniCraft]

My bestselling bird pin (quetzal) is not visible on search using incognito search. I have occasionally found it in a UK based local search but prior to this week it was one of the top listings if one searched quetzal and showed up top on every search. I found it listed on Temu last week. Our photos are registered under UK copyright.

I filed a dcma takedown with Temu - it was taken down the next day. At the time I checked Shein and Ali express and it was not on either. 

This week a kind Etsy user notified me that my listing was up on Ali express. I checked and found a new listing using my photos and the same photos as the user in Temu. I filed a takedown with AliExpress 3 days ago and have heard nothing back not even a confirmation email. I checked again today and there is now a second listing up again using the same photos. Both pins look to be poorer quality than mine and soft enamel and the photos are terrible, nonetheless they have made one or 2 sales.

I have again filed the takedown, this time for both listings. Yet again  there was no acknowledgement from AliExpress via email etc. I did screenshot the submission page. 

What’s galling is that Etsy’s use of the blunt AI tool to search for listings that might be being resold is directly punishing sellers for the actions of Temu/aliexpress bootleggers. If a human looked at the Temu listings and looked at mine the difference is night and day in the quality of photos and pin and it’s really quite obvious who the scammer is. These Ali scammers take no care at all with their listings - they obviously have no emotional investment and put minuscule effort in staging what they are selling and produce it cheaply and shoddily. That alone is much more informative than a AI scan indicating two listings appear similar, and if a human was involved in the deranking process they would see that easily. Rather than assume the Etsy seller has been robbed Etsy’s default position is to assume the Etsy seller is the reseller.

 These Temu/Ali sellers can therefore now sell our product with impunity whilst I cannot sell my own creation here legitimately. I cannot find my listing on erank or on incognito search of Etsy - and am now making no sales on my own item. 

I am here to ask the best/most efficient way I go about getting Etsy to rank my listing again in search? Thanks in advance for your help - I found the advice in the forum to and from others who have gone through this very helpful in working out how to file the DCMAs etc.

[cindylouwho2]

You are probably confusing 2 different issues here. The copyright infringement is annoying and never-ending, and I do really sympathize on how hard it is to get the problems resolved. 

That likely has nothing to do with whether or not you can find your pin. It's definitely not removed/deindexed, as I can find it in several searches. It is #1 for "quetzal pin" and top row for "quetzal" for me incognito. So Etsy has NOT taken the usual action for duplicate photos (yet). 

There can be many reasons you did not find it. You may be subject to frequency capping, especially if you are searching your own stuff often enough to know where it usually ranks. While incognito removes your account's history, search still personalizes and contextualizes based on your device, device settings, location etc. It knows a lot of searches for this word are not leading to conversions in your area, so it will start showing different things, for example. 

Etsy may also be testing; I am more likely to get a test search incognito. 

(btw, I like your new photos - good work!)

[BagmakerSupply]

@KanjaniCraft: Keep in mind that if everyone on this forum searched for the exact same phrase they would all get different results. Because of "personalized searches" you can NOT rely on anyone's search results to define how your listing is ranked. There are many many factors that affect listing placement and the relative weight of each factor probably changes constantly. Even exact word matches to your title no longer ensure that you will appear on page 1. Your listing may be appearing on page 251 and Etsy is only showing the first 250 pages to the world.

@cindylouwho2has some good points about why something might appear to not show up. Unless you use a VPN (and many sites block known VPN addresses) your IP address, browser, browser's settings, operating system, and even your internet searches are still provided even in incognito mode. Privacy / incognito mode really only hides what you were doing from other users of your device not from the sites you visited.

[KanjaniCraft]

Thanks you both for your replies and explanations and for your search results!  I am sorry - I am experiencing a sales dip for this pin but have conflated the unknown reasons for this with my finding the copiers at the same time.

I do search for this pin a lot, lol! And yes - I have been forgetting to use my vpn - I just did a vpn search and did find it, as you say.

I didn’t used to find the searches I do hurt the listing ranking in my results. But now it doesn’t show up so I don’t know maybe it does…

Regarding results for buyers, I usually get a few likes daily and usually sell 1-2 each day, if I make any sales. But both likes and sales have stopped almost completely in the last 2 weeks (I have sold 5 in this time and 3 were in one day so most days I sold none).Whilst sales of my other, less popular, pins have continued throughout. So something about that listing feels “targeted” although it probably isn’t.

I hope Ali express takes them down soon. 

@cindylouwho2 thanks for the photo compliment! I am not sure if you’re referring to the new Christmas mini pin photos but I followed the advice/observations you made last week about textured backgrounds and seasonal props to try it out, so thank you!

The other listing photos I had changed earlier this year although I am planning to reshoot most of them again shortly as many are still way too cluttered (eg earrings) or poorly staged and to A|B test as you suggested. I’m going try to use some simple textured background/simple seasonal props options versus the plain white backgrounds and see how they do comparatively.

[CraftyCornishMaids]

Our photos are registered under UK copyright.

The UK does not have a system of registering for copyright, the USA does, but we don't

we have rules for copyright, based on the Berne Convention, but no registration system

...

if you keep searching for the same thing, and don't buy it, it will go further down in your search, as etsy shows you different things it thinks you might buy.

I can find it on page 1 in search

[KanjaniCraft]

Thank you for the clarification!

Yes - as you say -there is no official UK register but we found we needed to have registration somewhere to be able to facilitate dcma takedowns via some of the sites so we have registered all our images with a registration service as the US service seemed quite cumbersome and a lot more expensive. This enables  us to supply a registration certificate and number which places like Ali express insist on us supplying in order to be able to even file the takedown request.

Thank you for your search information! I hope it’s just a temporary sales lull for this pin, it’s one of the lynch pins of my shop…

[CraftyCornishMaids]

@KanjaniCraft 

that's very interesting, I didn't know you could do that, who did you register with?

[KanjaniCraft]

There are a number you can use but we liked and chose protect my work. You get the certificate and number instantly, you can bulk upload. You can download certificates or share links to them as needed. We signed up in March and I have supplied the certificates a number of times to other sellers or Etsy or Temu with good effect. Ali express has been the first bad/slow experience and I don’t think it’s anything to do with the certificate at all…

[CraftyCornishMaids]

Thank you

[GlancesBackVintage]

Ali is notorious for ignoring take down notices, it is easier to have the photo removed from google- which removes it from most searches. 

https://support.google.com/legal/troubleshooter/1114905?hl=en

[KanjaniCraft]

Oh - how disappointing. Thanks for this I will try this.