Wrongly removed listings

[HalfOunce]

I've seen a few threads on this but has anyone managed to find a satisfactory solution to when the Etsy bots are automatically removing listings?

My Etsy shop started in 2017 and we've sold 15K cosmetic products, all handmade by myself or members of my team.  Occasionally I have listings taken down; generally I understand and accept the reasoning, but on occasion, the reasoning is incorrect. I have a couple of deactivated listings that have apparently been taken down due to being 'Not Handmade' (they are both items, handmade by my company, with labelling created by me and photographs taken by me). 

I've tried various routes to challenge the judgements over the years - Tweeting, emailing the safety team, contacting Etsy Chat etc but the policy is they won't discuss it. It's frustrating that there's no opportunity to offer evidence contrary to the judgement (as you can on Amazon) or a human to discuss the judgement with (as per ebay). 

Any advice on this would be appreciated. 

[CraftyCornishMaids]

you have - lip repair - de-stress - etc - medical claims

and you don't have your registration for selling cosmetics - which is what your items are - and your responsible person too

(as you sell to NI, you also have to register with the EU database)

[HalfOunce]

thanks for your response. 

our products are registered as cosmetics on UK and EU databases.  But I agree the de-stress and similar claims could considered medicinal rather than aroma therapy so accept that. 

I hadn't considered that 'Lip Repair' could be considered medicinal. It's a prolific term in cosmetic products. 

[HalfOunce]

thanks for your response. 

our products are registered as cosmetics on UK and EU databases.  I do agree the de-stress and similar claims could considered medicinal rather than aroma therapy so accept why those have been taken down. 

I hadn't considered that 'Lip Repair' could be flagged as medicinal. It's a prolific term in cosmetic products. 

[ArtDollsbyJD]

@HalfOunce   Etsy does not want any shop to make medical or herbal claims of any sort.  Even sellers in the US who are registered with the FDA cannot make claims.

[vintageNCtreasures]

If the reason was for creativity standards, it could be anything, not just handmade, could mean you're making medical/healing statements which is a no no.

You have items "made by" you.
Made by means personally made by YOU and no one else.

You say members of your team help make these items yet you only have 2 members noted and neither states either of you made the items.
You have "curator, designer, owner" and the other member you have "owner, shipper, customer service".

I would think if "your" company made these items that "you" designed and they're only made for you then you'd have to list them as a production partner and you have to put "designed by" and NOT "made by". 

Working with Production Partners on Etsy – Etsy Help

What Can I Sell on Etsy? – Etsy Help

Made by a seller

Items that fall under "Made by a seller" are physical items that are made by you, the seller.

Any items made by you, the seller, must:

• Be physically made by hand, or produced using computerized tools like a 3D printer, CNC or Cricut machine

Designed by a seller

As a seller, you can offer your original design as a digital download, or use a third party to produce or print your design onto a physical item. This category also includes seller-prompted AI creations. 

More info on this link:

Etsy's Creativity Standards - Our House Rules | Etsy

[HalfOunce]

If Etsy didn't like that we're a company (rather than just 2 individuals) I would expect the whole account to be closed. Why take exception to individual products. 

Just to be clear, we don't have a third party production partner. We (me, my business partner and some other people working for us) make the products, by hand. 

[vintageNCtreasures]

@HalfOunce 

Then you have to NAME every, single person as a shop member that "helps" you make these products.

You only have you and one other person and the profile doesn't mention on either that either of you "make" these items.

You have "curator, designer, owner" and the other member you have "owner, shipper, customer service".

[ArtDollsbyJD]

@HalfOunce   All people who work in your company are to be listed in the About page.

Etsy can start with individual products and then move on to larger issues if more is brought to their attention.   

You need your GDPR and Right of withdrawal as well in your shop policies.

The little things can add up. 

[screamprops]

I don't think anyone has managed to find out what they can do to prevent listings from being removed. The bots take them down and Etsy got rid of loads of staff, so it seems that there is no-one to rectify these mistakes. My advice is change the photos and description as much as you can when you relist them and hope for the best. 

Don't worry about comments about selling to NI. There is no-one to enforce the new regulations and no-one will find out or care if you continue selling there.

[CraftyCornishMaids]

@screamprops 

The OP is selling cosmetics,

the registration laws for selling cosmetics to NI have been there for years - it is not new

It was there when we were part of the EU, and we carried on the laws, they are the same laws, they are not new laws.

AND

they haven't done it for GB either

When you need to submit a cosmetic product notification

If you are making cosmetic products available to consumers in Great Britain (GB: England, Scotland, and Wales), you must notify your cosmetic products using the Submit cosmetic product notifications service.

Access the Submit cosmetic product notifications service

There is a separate process for placing cosmetic products on the market in Northern Ireland.

....

it is NOTHING to do with the new EU GPSR laws

It's to do with selling cosmetics

and there is a portal, specifically for reporting sellers, who do not comply with the cosmetics regulations - they will and do find out

[HalfOunce]

Interesting that people are mentioning the cosmetics legislation. Ironically Etsy lets anyone sell cosmetics....other platforms review safety assessments and data sheets but Etsy doesn't have any such process. Nor does let you list the ingredients using INCI nomenclature since they don't allow brackets.

[ArtDollsbyJD]

@HalfOunce   Etsy does not want to 'police' cosmetics more than they do for anything else.  They expect sellers to follow the laws of their countries true enough but they aren't going to monitor.

What they don't want is claims that something heals or works for a certain ailment as outlined in the TOU's.  None of that can be proven and Etsy does not want to have to arbitrated such issues so no to making any sort of healing/medical claim.      

[CatsWhiskersCurios]

You are selling a number of products by Revered Beard, that are available in multiple other places.  Reselling is not permitted, and nor are any medical claims like 'anxiety remedy'.

[vintageNCtreasures]

I found that item on eBay (seller in TX) Same exact item.

Does the OP sell "these" items their company makes for others to resell? 

Or is the OP buying these items from "The Revered Beard" company to resell? That company's founders name is Tyler and has been selling online since 2011.
If this is the case, then you can't sell those items here because you didn't make them.

I also found it on Amazon.

[HalfOunce]

I created 'The Revered Beard'  - it's just the product name and it's all owned by my company. 

The multiple places are mostly other platforms I'm selling through. Although we do also offer wholesale to retailers

[vintageNCtreasures]

@HalfOunce 
So is the eBay seller from TX selling the Revered beard items you or if this someone you sold your products to so they can resell them???

If so, then it looks like you are also reselling these items because other people are selling the exact item with the exact pictures.

ETA: on the Revered Beard website the "Founders" name is Tyler, and has been selling online since 2011.

You have on your info / bio on Etsy that your name is Jon........and you have been designing and producing cosmetic products since 2014.

So you designed this Revered Beard item 3 years AFTER the founder of Revered Beard started selling the product in 2011????
Something doesn't add up at all, IMO.

So if the actual founder of Revered Beard is Tyler why isn't Tyler's name on your shop here and why don't the years match??

[CoquetteBath]

boy you have some problematic products.

the 'womanpause' item is just....egregious. You cannot make the claims that you are. 'Restoring hormonal balance' is about as blatant a medical claim as any I've seen.

I'm in your category. First, I commend you on some lovely packaging. BUT the rules be that you cannot make such claims unless you have government approval. And in the US, that means the FDA. I'm sure the UK has similar standards (but since I don't sell in the UK, not up on those)...

whatever...this is the type of product that should not be. And if you are reselling the work of others (as @CatsWhiskersCurios mentioned above) that's a huge no no, too.

you do you.

[HalfOunce]

The UK has a different approach than the US but similarly we are not allowed to make medical claims.... so I do appreciate that some of Etsy's enforcements are reasonable on those grounds. 

Just to respond to your comments; our product labelling and claims are based on guidance for aroma therapies and essential oils. For example, the wording you're quoting says  phytoestrogen restores hormonal balance, which has been shown in a clinical environment. We specifically pull out the ingredients with proven benefits rather than referring to the product as a whole having those benefits....because we've not conducted clinical trials to back the claim.

[CoquetteBath]

@HalfOunce 

research may say that.

but in the US, to say that, your individual product (not one from someone else, or the base ingredient) has to be double blind tested and found to do what you say...or you cannot say that.

otherwise, this is more on the 'lore' side of the house.

and the entire product HAS to have the clinical trials to say it...

so again, nope. Can't. It is against the law here.

[CraftyCornishMaids]

etsy says you can't make medical claims,

it's s stipulation of selling here

full stop

whether it is about the ingredient, or product, doesn't matter

no medical claims can be made

[HalfOunce]

@ vintageNCtreasures We do wholesale so yes, the TX seller on ebay has bought them from me. I also offer our image library to any retailer that wants them. This is actually a very plausible explanation to my problem  ....if Etsy is trawling the web for images that match my Etsy listings and making the assumption that I don't own them.  Frustrating if that's the case because it's assuming we're the reseller and not giving me the opportunity to prove otherwise. 

I don't know what website you're referring to but we have registered the name as a trademark under the cosmetics category in the UK. Never heard of Tyler but we registered the trademark years ago and it was never contested.

I will also take your advice and list 'maker' as one of our roles but that wouldnt explain why Etsy was singling out individual listings. 

[vintageNCtreasures]

If that person in TX bought this wholesale from you then it does look like you're reselling because of the same pictures, same name of the product.

If you're selling other products to people wholesale and they are reselling other products you have, then it could be that Etsy's bots found those pictures on Ebay, Amazon or on other sites and that is why they've been removed/flagged.

I was referring to the website "Revered Beards" that seems to have had that name since 2011 and it mentions Tyler.
I don't know their location, doesn't state on their site.

You need to LIST everyone that helps you make these products.

You only have you and another person listed and from what you state there's more than 2 people that are making these items.

[BagmakerSupply]

@HalfOunce: "... but that wouldnt explain why Etsy was singling out individual listings." While Etsy seems to primarily check listings when they are created, edited, or renewed we do not know the secret formula they use to decide when or if to check a specific listing. Also, the trigger that flagged your listing may be more complex than a single factor.

"We do wholesale ..." One of Etsy's criteria seems to be uniqueness - so regardless of whether or not you are the maker, the item is no longer "unique" if someone else is selling it, particularly if they are using your pictures.

[vintageNCtreasures]

@HalfOunce 
You wrote "We (me, my business partner and some other people working for us) make the products, by hand" and "all handmade by myself or members of my team."

You have to NAME all these members of your team under "shop members".