'Thank You' note from other seller has penalized my Star Seller rating?

[#1]

I own a store, but I also purchased a digital download from a different seller. The other seller sent me a thank you note. I did not reply, because why would I? Now Etsy has used this in my Star Seller calculation and penalized me for not responding. Is this ridiculous or is it just me?

[BootifulLabels]

@WesthillPrints 

Would you rather Etsy read every one of our messages to determine if they are from a buyer or another seller?  And if from another seller, which of the two was the seller in this specific transaction and which the buyer? 

Realistically, that doesn't make sense, and wouldn't go down well with most of the membership, let alone fit within most countries' privacy laws.

As I stated above, get yourself a buyer only account and keep the two activities separate and you won't need to worry.  Simple solution, and everyone's privacy is protected.

[WesthillPrints]

@BootifulLabels An easy fix would be to create separate inboxes for messages from buyers vs. sellers, just like they do with "From Etsy", or "All", or any of the other ones. Simple.

Also, I think you might be in for a bit of a surprise when it comes to what you think is "private" on Etsy.

[BagmakerSupply]

@WesthillPrints: "... separate inboxes for messages from buyers vs. sellers ..." Totally agree with you that the current system needs improvement, but what do you do with a message from someone who you have sold something to and have also bought from?

Do you want some bot reading every one of your messages and guessing? How many threads would there be in this forum that "some bot incorrectly classified my message"?

[WitticismsRus]

It's lame but the system is completely automated and doesn't know if the message is from a buyer or another seller. It isn't reading every message and making a decision if it's from a seller or a customer or what it's about. It's a computer program that calculates data. It just sees a message and calculated the response time. I know I sure don't want etsy or some bot reading my messages.

Bottom line...you have to either reply or mark as spam.

It takes just a few seconds to mark spam as spam or send a quick thank you reply for nonspam messages. Or you can set up an auto-reply every 5 days or make a separate buying only account. You have options and Etsy provides tools for sellers to use , it's up to us to us to use them if we want to do the whole star seller thing.

[WesthillPrints]

"It isn't reading every message and making a decision if it's from a seller or a customer or what it's about." That's the point. As someone with a background in tech, I can absolutely tell you with 100% certainty that under the hood, Etsy has the capability to read every single message on the platform. The fact that it's designed to not tell the difference between buyer and seller is on purpose, and that's the problem. It's software. That is not a mistake. It's built that way on purpose so that Etsy can implement rules that tilt the advantage in their favor. You think your Etsy messages are secure lol?

[WitticismsRus]

No, I certainly don't think messages are secure nor was I suggesting they were. Nothing on the internet truly is.

My point was more about etsys generally bad programming with most things and how it gets things wrong regularly. Example- all the incorrect bot listing removals of truly handmade items etc. It takes months to get those fixed and relisted as it is. It's bad bots gone wild around here. It would be a nightmare if they added messages to that. No thank you. I don't trust etsys programming to get it right. I'm happy managing my own messages. 

[PhenomenalWomenShop]

That happened to me in December. 23 months of SS, and I did not reply to a thank you. Sigh.  Oh well.

[LynnsLittleShop]

@WesthillPrints I can sympathize with you, shortly after they started the star seller thing, I had a buyer ask me to cancel an order since she needed another size pattern and not the size she bought. I canceled and refunded her order and sent a message through that page, after all it does say message to buyer on it, but as it turned out that message didn't count for star seller. Yes, I thought it was ridiculous, too but sometimes I just have to learn things the hard way. Try sending yours to spam and see if your score goes up, sometimes that works. 

[ChillwolfArt]

In your OP you asked, "Is this ridiculous or is it just me?"

And you responded to TheVintagePineapple and ThePurplePuppy, "Believe it or not, some messages don't require a response, and are not spam. I know that requires a little extra brainpower to wrap your head around, but you can do, I believe in you!"

No one needs to wrap their head around anything, nor do they need extra brainpower to do so. That's disrespectful and rude. People are explaining to you the rules of the SS Metrics, rules which they did not make, Etsy did. The rules also state that you have to have a certain number of sales and dollar amount (I believe 5 sales, $300.00; I could be wrong about that). That never made a whole lot of sense to me (and how it applies to receiving the SS Badge), but again those are Etsy rules. 

Bottom line, you asked. You don't have to abide by it. 

[WesthillPrints]

@ChillwolfArt I didn't ask for clarification on the rules. I can read. People keep sending me the rules. I don't need them to send me the rules. I can see them. But sometimes rules don't make sense. Why is that hard to comprehend?

[ChillwolfArt]

I never said it made sense.  And I'm comprehending just fine, Thank You very much.

[bohemians]

I don't need them to send me the rules. I can see them. But sometimes rules don't make sense. Why is that hard to comprehend?

What discussion DO you want then?
Your exact concern has been brought up frequently in the forum since the SSB was rolled out. It’s not like any of us have a say in how Etsy chooses to do their programming.

[mommawhazelsquilts]

Out of the 5 requirements for SSB, Messaging is the only one that we as sellers can completely control.

Just don't understand why it's so hard to type a couple of words or send an emoji.

Control what you can!  If you don't like the rules - it's simple - don't play the game.

[audreytherese]

Here's the thing. Your shop is new. New shops often seem to believe the answer is so easy and Etsy should just fix it. It's best to learn when you're still new that isn't how it works. There's a lot of things on this site that need to be fixed. Messages from other sellers counting towards the SS is the very bottom of that list, and since there are so many easy ways to work within the program, in reality it's not on any list to fix. It's not going to make Etsy more money, so how can they justify paying programmers to do this? Plus, as a seller, I buy from many other shops. Other shops purchase from me. Many of these we are buying from each other. Who is to say whose message should be disregarded in those situations? 

Regardless, even if you did respond, you haven't made the basic requirements for the program and aren't eligible for it yet anyway. So even if you had responded, or marked as spam, you still wouldn't be getting the SS badge. Missing this message didn't disqualify you, not being eligible yet disqualified you. 

[mommawhazelsquilts]

@audreytherese 

Good catch!  Why are we even responding to this?

[LaRenaissanceGirl]

Why don't they just get rid of Star Seller entirely? It's dumb. It has done very little to improve the selling experience. It's mostly caused problems and angst. (And the months that I achieve the star, my sales ironically go down, vs. when I don't have it.)

I can't speak to the buying experience, because it made no difference to me as a buyer. 

[UniqueGiftOrnaments]

@LaRenaissanceGirl    I agree with you 100%. All the stupid star did was stress sellers out. And I bet that most buyers don't even notice it anymore after all this time. They most likely purchase based on reviews.

[BeaconwoodDettman]

@LaRenaissanceGirl But what if there was a seller that responded to one message in 24 hours, the next message in 3 days, the next message in 2 weeks, and some messages don't get a response at all? And that seller ships on time sometimes, but other times takes weeks. And so on - basically they are bad sellers that you and I would never want to buy from. 

How do we identify those people? If someone has a bad experience with a seller like that, they will never come back to Etsy, and they will tell their friends about their bad experience. They will never buy from your shop or mine. 

There needs to be some way. Honestly, I would be in favor of kicking sellers like that off of Etsy - if you can't respond to messages on time, and you can't ship on time, you can't sell here. 

I realize 5-star reviews are different, that's a whole other discussion. But messages and shipping are generally within our control. Everyone will miss those goals sometimes, but if you can't meet them on an ongoing basis, you need to be off Etsy, or at least identified. The "identification" we have now is the Star Seller badge. 

[BlueCatStudioShop]

@WesthillPrints 

You must answer EVERY message you get or send it to spam. PERIOD.

[BeaconwoodDettman]

@WesthillPrints Long term, Etsy needs to fix this. I am sure there's a way, I used to work with developers who would tackle situations much more complex than this. 

Since Etsy knows that you are both a "seller" and a "buyer" in this situation, messages from another "seller" to you (a "buyer") after a purchase by you should be exempt from your Star Seller response requirement. 

If someone messages when there hasn't been a purchase by you, you are a "seller" (whether they buy from you or not), you need to respond within 24 hours as they are your customers - that's where the Star Seller response requirement should apply. 

All of this can be automated, there's no need for Etsy to read all messages as some have mentioned. 

Short term, reply to everything as others have mentioned. It's a crude "solution" but it's all there is at this point. 

[audreytherese]

I disagree that Etsy ever needs to fix this. 

You say you worked with developers before. Any idea how much they get paid? It's not chump change. Why would Etsy invest that kind of money into 'fixing' a problem that's not really a problem? 

Your solution of "messages from another "seller" to you (a "buyer") after a purchase by you should be exempt from your Star Seller response requirement. " is too shortsighted. What if they made a purchase, that shop happened to notice they have a shop and had a question about one of their items? They shouldn't have to respond just because they had already made a purchase from that shop? 

[PillowDetails]

I got caught out in this, early on in the SS program.  Now I know.  And now the OP knows - either answer, or take the hit - or set up auto-reply for all messages.  No sense in wondering why Etsy did that - it just IS.

I seem to remember, even from the beginning where Sellers were complaining about the ridiculous metrics, that it is stated that Etsy is not responsible for any emotional or mental distress caused by the Star Seller program.  So they knew there would be issues like this.

[PillowDetails]

As for replying to first-time messages that don't need a response - I use emojis - a thumbs-up or smiley face.

Oh - and here this part is -

https://www.etsy.com/legal/policy/star-seller-terms-and-conditions/1020908425032

Limitation of Liability

ETSY WILL NOT BE LIABLE FOR ANY INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, EXEMPLARY OR CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES, INCLUDING LOST PROFITS, LOSS OF DATA OR LOSS OF GOODWILL, SERVICE INTERRUPTION, COMPUTER OR MOBILE DEVICE DAMAGE OR SYSTEM FAILURE, OR FOR ANY DAMAGES FOR PERSONAL OR BODILY INJURY OR EMOTIONAL DISTRESS ARISING OUT OF OR IN CONNECTION WITH THESE TERMS OR THE STAR SELLER PROGRAM.

[VINTAGEbytheMAGPIE]

@WesthillPrints you came to the forum with a headline which blamed another seller for you loosing your Star Seller. the replies from other sellers here are explaining that this isn't the case , you just misunderstood how this system driven measuring metric works.

So why are you arguing with those trying to offer information and help ?

It's your business so it's up to you to decide if you want to get involved in Star Seller or not. So you have two choices

1. Ignore star seller, and run your business as you see fit.

2. Be involved in the Star seller metric and follow its black and white messaging metric.

Also for info you have agency here, had you have utilised your automated message response or sent the reply to spam, then it wouldn't have affected your metrics. You may want to consider using these tool in the future.

If you truly disagree with the system then, you can always feed this back to Etsy.