Multiple "Etsy Bots" performing different functions? Last week handmade. Now drug paraphernalia.

[VooVooDesign]

Is Etsy training different types of bots, like there are sniffer dogs, tracker dogs, cadaver dogs, etc.

Anyone know how bots work?

Also, can bots not be trained to alert to images? There was a shop critique query post recently which prompted a reply from someone who posted links of the same image in the OP's shop in at least three others. Can bots be trained to see that?

That would of course be an issue for seller of certain craft supplies. But if you supposedly make a turquoise bracelet it isn't possible other makers have your exact photos even if using identical materials.

[TheYayAtelier]

Could be separate programs (Bots), or it could be separate subroutines in a single program. Also, seems fairly likely there's more than one bot instance running at one time, to distribute the load and scale it up. But then again, perhaps it's threads in a single program, that's automatically hashed out to different cpus in a server farm. Lots of ways to implement this.

[SVGRox]

AI Bots are given criteria by a human, so they are only as good as human on Etsy who configures them to carry out tasks

[BagmakerSupply]

@VooVooDesign: At its root, a bot is nothing more than a program that does things based on true and false answers. For example: if the listing contains the word "amber" or the word "ivory" of the word "aardvark" then deactivate the listing". Undoubtedly (hopefully) the actual bots are a bit more sophisticated. How well they perform is directly linked to the underlying coding. Presumably at least some of the Etsy bots are designed by artificial intelligence programs (a second layer where issues may be introduced).

[LastCentury]

You would think with the speed of google image search, that Etsy's bots should also be able to spot the exact same turquoise beaded bracelet image from those 3 etsy sellers AND the aliexpress site (from that thread a few days ago which I thought would get deleted lol). Sounds like a great idea but that would leave a lot of sellers who use digital mockups in an uproar. 

And not just deactivation buzz word bots, but shadowbanning buzz word bots, which may as well be deactivation because you can't find the item in etsy or shop search unless you only use the exact shadowbanned word or phrase and then you get a sea of adult content which isn't always the niche of the item you're trying to sell. UGH!!! I'm experiencing this now for the 3rd time.

[EarthSisterStudioCo]

i picture the etsy bots as looking like Ms. Pac-Man but with like vicious vampire teeth or something ok i have a weird overactive imagination.

i do like the idea of there being specific bots...i bet that is true...like some are trained for calling everything drug paraphernalia or whatever...some are trained to do different things.

i do agree with you, it should be possible to do image searches and flag all the matching photos, and even maybe program them to ignore supply sellers. because supply sellers could be all getting the same supplies, theres only so many ways to photograph simple stuff like that and supply sellers often use pictures from the wholesale suppliers.

but yeah i would think they can do a reverse image search same as you can to find matching photos across the internet. that would get a lot of listings flagged.

[Amaradorn]

@EarthSisterStudioCo have you seen the 1995 film of Steven King's The Langoliers? Yeah, they look like that.

[JDTotesnDolls]

I would be carefuld about the reverse image search.  While useful at times, indiscriminate use can damage good shops who use their photos across social media.

There has to be human intervention possible rather than just relying on BOTS which is a problem right now for Etsy. 

[VooVooDesign]

@JDTotesnDolls There could be a bot to flag handmade items' images which appear in multiple Etsy shops. 

At one point there were dozens of identical listings for Nordic Greek David Head Statue Vase vases, for example. It took people months of repeated reporting to get Etsy to slowly begin removing some of them (they are returning, unfortunately). 

A bot should be able to be trained to detect such listings instantly then have a human review.

[EarthSisterStudioCo]

right, they would need humans to verify things. and i think etsy shouldnt be doing this with - deactivate first, ask questions later - but that is what they are doing anyway.

i would think it could just flag a lot of listings, all the wrong deactivations we are seeing, they couldve instead set aside a whole batch of listings that are being flagged, and then had humans go through a pile of these every day, and only then deactivate the ones the humans decide shouldnt be here.

or at the least they should have a system where its super easy to appeal. so instead of this is a final desicion or the other wording where they make it seem like theres nothing you can do -- they could send it in the email that - if you feel this is error go to this easy hot link and submit proof and more info of why you feel this is in error. then humans can verify each of those listings and shops.

but of course no one asked me ! although this seems kinda obvious. but instead etsy is on this ...maybe because they feel the time pressure, deactivate first ask questions later....and letting bots just take them down. the bots should just flag them and compile for human review.

[EarthSisterStudioCo]

as for the david head thats probably just MOLDS. they probably all use the same mold, although some of them likely buy and resell the work of a factory making them in molds. anywho if someone has a david head mold, that they actually pour themselves that would be etsy legal.

its maybe weird but those are the kind of things that bother me the most, the deep fakes. as in fair trade, whether or not its actually FAIR trade (i doubt it) -- just by being "fair trade" its not etsy legal.

or handmade by someone, but not the seller...makers are in mexico, africa, etc etc, but seller is in new york, LA or whatever...yeah not etsy legal, and maybe quite exploititive, pretending its "fair" trade, where seller makes more money than the makers, and makers are desperate for anything so take pennies on the dollar.

that and famous artists, stuff in the public domain, stuff where people buy the image. like monet on a shower curtain, POD, or van gogh. for whatever reason seeing van gogh being put on things pisses me off more than the straight up resellers, who i think are really clueless. because van gogh, like the stereo typical starving artist, never got paid properly for his awesome work...yet these sellers can slap it on a shower curtain or whatever else, and make more money than he ever did. and its really blatant that they didnt design it, choosing your fave van gogh and slapping it on something with POD is not etsy legal. same as any other artist in the public domain or whatever. but etsy seems to like these types of deep fakes, but its super clear its not etsy legal.

idk what i really think is etsy should just open up a new section of the site for everything else, open the floodgates, but segregate it out to its own corner. if etsy needs these people for money then charge them more, have a section for whatever deep fakes, fair trade and resellers, but give real handmade artisans perks, like lower fees and some badge that says verified artist or whatever.

in this way instead of removing the listings, they move them over to the everything else section. by default etsy search shows OG etsy, whats now etsy legal, artisans and designers who have been verified. the everything else section has its own corner. and like amazon, since etsy wants to be amazon or whatecer, charge handmade sellers and OG etsy legal stuff a lesser rate....have the resellers in their own corner that people who want that seek it out, but handmade is what the default search prioritizes.

and even with that etsy would fumble it and probably have real artisans being seen as everything else. but again have a simple process where if you feel this is error - got to this easy hot link and fill out more info, provide proof.

[VooVooDesign]

@EarthSisterStudioCo Re the David's heads, and I'm not picking on those in particular really, some of them no doubt are made from molds, true. However, back in the heydey of Nordic Greek David's  head vases, there were dozens of listings in dozens of shops all showing the vases in the same room, with the same props, right down to the artfully arranged dried flowers and grasses poking from the vases. And those photos originated from one or more of the Alis.

It is my belief that the wholesaler uses a special studio for those products and others. 

The vases (and other household decor items) I'm moaning and whining about are not made by Maryanne in her garage. If poor Maryanne is making them she's got still got some stiff competition from the Alis.

[BagmakerSupply]

@LastCentury @EarthSisterStudioCo : Reverse image search itself would be relatively easy to implement, but how well would it be implemented to discriminate between true resellers and legitimate handmade sellers who just have promoted their item on various platforms and perhaps even on their own website? What about the legitimate handmade sellers who use their Etsy pictures on their social media? Or a happy buyer who posts a link on their social media and now that picture is in even more multiple places? Just look at how many threads there are in this forum claiming unjustified listing deactivations already.

[VooVooDesign]

Good point.

At the very least though there should be a system that can recognize the same images on supposedly handmade items across Etsy shops.

[Adorabilities]

This would certainly be an issue for those who also sell on Amazon. Seeing the same photo on Amazon often results in assumptions of reselling, even by non-bots.

[JDTotesnDolls]

I'm sure there are different BOTS with different programming to do all sorts of functions for Etsy.  And the bots keep changing so there is no way to guess the behavior.  And programmed with AI so they develop on their own as they acquire more knowledge.

[EALuxuryInvitations]

What does my Etsy shop look like?  I'm curious about your comments and suggestions.  You can send me a message for the products or recommendations you like.