Testing Vs. Labeling

[#1]

Ok...... I am confused... When I first opened shop a few months ago the CPSIA had a list of materials that were deemed acceptible such as fabric and thread (the only materials I use for children's items) and they were thus exempt from testing as long as I did not treat them with anything or go outside of that list. So now there is this labeling issue, do I still have to label a product made from the materials they have stated are ok to combine and sell without testing. If so (and I apologize for the repetition with other threads) does anyone have a link to what the label must contain?
AGH a cotton pillow for kids should not be this complicated!

[Former_Member]

It just applies to the U.S. sellers.
I agree Etsy needs to "spell it out" for us.
What kind of labels do you put on hair items?
It is easier to sew in labels on blankets/quilts/pillows.
If sellers do as they say Etsy will lose alot of sellers(alot have told me they will close down their shops)
With $ times being hard this does not make sense.
How will they test used/thrift stores,yard sales,gifts???
Alot of people are shopping these places now.
Alot of people are donating to these places.
Etsy please help.

[FayeMaloneDesigns]

It's not Etsy's responsibilty to interpret the law for us. Nor should they be liable for any information or misinformation they might give us. How can they say what we are to do, when the details are even unknown to the CPSC?

Everyone should have the link to the CPSC website, sign up for their email alerts so you will receive changes in the law, and everyone should have read the law, and read as much as you could about all the other directives that affect your business. Download, or write and ask for the Guide to the Consumer Product Safety Imporvement Act for Small Businesses, Reseller, Crafters and Charities.

[Former_Member]

FayeMalone is right. Etsy cannot and should not give legal advice.

You should be reading and researching as much as you can. Get beyond the idea that you don't understand, it's too confusing, there's too much to read, etc. It's time to dig into the information provided and work with what you've got.

I do provide information on my blog regarding my interpretations of many of the questions asked here.

In terms of the original post, it is not Testing VS. Labeling. They are 2 separate (but equal) requirements of the law. One does not depend on the other. Here is my blog post on labeling: http://buggalove.blogspot.com/2009/06/labeling-requirements-for-cpsia.html

Here is my latest blog post which contains a webinar from July 1st that outlines labeling requirements: http://buggalove.blogspot.com/2009/07/cpsia-webinar.html

[MamaFamilias]

myblessedbaby, I had the same idea, but stockpiling is specifically banned. poop.

[TheWrapScrapPony]

mamafamilias says:
myblessedbaby, I had the same idea, but stockpiling is specifically banned. poop.

--------------
What do you mean, it's banned?

I wouldn't necessarily call it stockpiling though. I'm just sewing up carriers with the fabric I currently have on hand up until August 14th. I don't think I have enough energy or supplies to make what anyone would call a stockpile :)

[Former_Member]

I just ment it would be nice for the law to be put where the average person understood it.
I don't have time to read everyone's blog.
Sorry, didn't mean to ruffle anyone's feathers.
I know Etsy is not law but it sure will effect them and other handmade sites.

[Former_Member]

What about the labels themselves and testing? Technically, aren't the labels we come up with to "permanently attach" and the permanent markers we use (if you go that route) subject to testing too?

[Former_Member]

Unfortunately, hoping that the new head will change it is hoping for a miracle. From what I have heard from members of the CPSC, the new head is not on our side for changing things to make them easier for manufacturers(us). The labeling requirement is going to be in affect in just a matter of weeks. I have no idea yet how I am going to comply. I have fabric labels but including batch and item #'s is going to be a nightmare!

[FayeMaloneDesigns]

whatshername, You didn't ruffle my feathers, hope I didn't ruffle yours, not my intent. But, I know reading the law is daunting, but it is our responsibility as business owners to know it, try to follow the changes, (and the easiest way is to get the email alerts from cpsc) and keept the current "guide" issued by the cpsc at our right hand. If it all very frustrating, we all agree.

[Former_Member]

I wonder if people here would be freaking out as much about CPSIA, if they were already following the laws that already apply to them. No offense folks, but all this stuff can be easily Googled. It's surprising (maybe it shouldn't be?) how many sellers seem to have no idea the rules apply to them. or- that the rules ALREADY applied to them.

All clothing needs a permanent label, long before and regardless of CPSIA:
http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/edu/pubs/business/textile/bus50.shtm

Pillows already needed labels. So did plush toys.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_label

(there are other things that need labels too- I just gave these particulars 'cause others mentioned them.)

Not to pick on one person, but "I don't have time to read everyone's blog" sums it up so well: it seems to be a commonly-held belief here (maybe in our entire culture?) that busyness exempts one from having to do things correctly or thoroughly.
I know people need to feel free to ask questions here without getting pounced on, & this is more of a response to several threads than this specific OP, but I always kinda want to ask - if you've been selling this stuff, why don't you know that already? Y'all agreed to abide by all laws that apply when you opened your shops.

[Former_Member]

I agree wholeheartedly. When you start a business you need to do reading and research on all things: taxes, business licensing, copyright information, and many many other things. CPSIA is just another thing to educate yourself about as a business owner.

I think the "I don't have time to read everyone's blog" may have been in response to me because I offered my blog as a resource. It has been seen by many Etsy folks as easy to read and often answers many FAQs. But if you're only looking for answers in one place, you're unlikely to get the full picture. Particularly with the rampant misunderstandings (and/or misinformation) of the law given.

[bobbinalong]

I look at this CPSIA labeling and testing slightly different than I think a lot of you. When I think of handmade, I think of one-of-a-kind items, unique, not mass-produced, fresh ideas, things perhaps our grandmother or mother made for us instead of buying an item, something original she came up with.

And I think what has happened, and probably because it is easier and cut down on time constrints, Congress took manufacturers, importers, small businesses, thrift stores, charities, and handmade, and put them in a big pot and stirred. So they are using the same laws for all. Laws that don't even make sense for us, for charities, etc. And ---- until we can get them to see how unreasonable this is, we will be fighting this thing to the nth degree. Frustratingly trying to make sense out of something that should not have happened in the first place. Something that common sense says cannot apply to everyone in the same manner.

I guess I picture what I make more in a category with a painter, where every picture is different. Or a person working with wood. I watched a couple of minutes of the hearings for the new Supreme Court Justice - hopefully - and I looked at those people doing the questioning and I just shook my head. It's no wonder this CPSIA is what it is.

[FayeMaloneDesigns]

I think so many people think that they can whip up a few things and sell them on the side and make a few bucks. And many get away with this. But for many of us this is a business, we take it quite seriously. We might be single moms, retirees like Bobbin and I trying to make ends meet, and hopefully have a little extra. I know many have said they are moms wanting to stay at home and raise their little ones, or suppliment the family income. But we also enjoy what we are doing/creating. It is a labor of love.

I know that I read and tried to follow all the labeling laws required of me before CPSIA. It is my responsibility as a business owner to do so. And for the most part it's not hard to do, the laws that were on the books are pretty reasonable as to labeling. But this law as written, and everyone of the "save the country it's a crisis" laws since have been totally insane, and without any working knowledge or concern how they will affect those who are governed by them.

But I really think that those that wrote these laws have no idea that there is a handmade movement. Nor do I think that they had any clue that so many people, artists, craftspeople, micro business owners even existed. They live and work and cavort in such a closed fairytale world. They are surrounded by people that use them, and are used by them. The rest of us smucks are the little people that they will come visit and shake hands with when they need something from us. Money for their reelection campaigns, and votes to send them back to their lives of luxury and power in DC. Then they go wash their hands and try to decide do I go home to the wife, or go see my girlfriend at the condo.

[MamaFamilias]

Just wanted to add dittos to AmyBlanford, BuggaLove, and Faye.

When it comes to testing the labels, since dyed fabric is exempt, I am assuming that ink falls into the dye category and does not need to be tested. Since lead is added to make paint dry faster and smoother, I can't imagine it would be added to ink. If anyone has info suggesting that lead is added to printer or marker ink, please share.

[weirdbuglady]

I'm with amy - when I was selling things that I considered kids toys, I added labels with all the appropriate info.

Now, however, I don't, as I consider them art pieces and not meant for little kids. I'm starting to gear myself more towards larger more intricate pieces and away from the small cutesy things.

As for the CPSIA stuff... it's bullcrap because it makes it virtually impossible for handmade crafters of one of a kind items to comply. Can't digest things that are only made once, for the permanent labels half the information doesn't even apply, and they're giving no guidance as deadlines get ever closer.

And it seems quite rare that I come across a toy, pillow or piece of clothing on etsy with an appropriate label. Makes me a little uneasy... as nice as it is to have that whole handmade feel, there *are* laws out there.

[Former_Member]

I do take my etsy store quite seriously and I have been trying to read up as much as I can on the laws.

As an Australian who has come into this in the middle of the changes, I am saying that I find it quite difficult to work out where the laws start and end. I DO find the official site difficult to interpret - that doesn't mean I'm lazy or stupid, just confused. And whilst it may not be Etsy's legal responsibility to help us to interpret these laws, I would like them to help us a bit more with understanding them. They do make money out of our businesses, so they have a direct interest in us staying in business.

People are worried that they will b soing something to contravene the laws. Nobosy wants to do the wrong thing. We just need some simple English.

Right, stepping off soapbox :)

[Former_Member]

"will b soing something to contravene the laws. Nobosy"

See, I feel so strongly I can't even spell anymore!

[Former_Member]

weirdbuglady says:
I'm with amy - when I was selling things that I considered kids toys, I added labels with all the appropriate info.

Now, however, I don't, as I consider them art pieces and not meant for little kids. I'm starting to gear myself more towards larger more intricate pieces and away from the small cutesy things.

***********
as the CPSIA rules are such blanket statements, including anything that might obviously appeal to a child, I have decided to at least temperarily stop production on some soft sculpture work that I had not even released yet. I don't believe that your work will be convered either unless laws are revised because of this "may appeal to" statement. If it looks soft and is representative of an animal I do not feel that I am safe producing it right now, even if it is specifically described as intended for adults 12 and older. I think that the "appeals to kids" bit is meant to keep people from using such marketing as "for grown ups only." It stinks, but I think one of a kind soft sculpture pieces could also be wiped out with this law.

[Former_Member]

I agree with bobbinalong's statement:

"I look at this CPSIA labeling and testing slightly different than I think a lot of you. When I think of handmade, I think of one-of-a-kind items, unique, not mass-produced, fresh ideas, things perhaps our grandmother or mother made for us instead of buying an item, something original she came up with."

I realize some people are here for a serious business, but when you're just starting out as a hand-crafter, these types of rules are difficult to comply with. How may community/charity craft sale clothes have you ever seen with FTC labels on them? I can't say I've seen any. Does it stop you from buying them? No. Have you ever seen a handmade quilt in a shop with a permanent label? I haven't.

I think there needs to be some sort of rule set out there to help out people who craft such things at a one at a time basis that allows them to sell their items without having to jump through impossible hoops.

[Former_Member]

CPSIA was written badly to be all inclusive. No provisions were made for craft artists or even grandma who sells her knitting at the church fair. There are no exceptions. You are subject to this Federal law to comply in all ways required - labels, testing, etc. Everyone who has tried to convince Congress for exemptions for crafts people and artists have gotten nowhere.

The law has stiff criminal penalties and enforcement has been placed into the hands of the Attorney General of each STATE. This means that a go-getter assistant DA who wants to make a name for himself can go crusading through the state and start bringing Federal charges all in the name of the "safety of our children"!

[ByNanasHands]

Weirdbuglady "Now, however, I don't, as I consider them art pieces and not meant for little kids."

Problem with this thought is that if the CPSIA THINKS your item can be used/played with by children you will have to comply with all laws pertaining to children's items. It's their call.....just you saying it's "not meant for little kids" isn't going to work with this one...sorry to say...

[FayeMaloneDesigns]

animalquackers says:

I don't believe that your work will be convered either unless laws are revised because of this "may appeal to" statement. If it looks soft and is representative of an animal I do not feel that I am safe producing it right now, even if it is specifically described as intended for adults 12 and older. I think that the "appeals to kids" bit is meant to keep people from using such marketing as "for grown ups only."

Where is this "may appeal to" verbage in any statement by the CPSC? I have searched and can not find it. I have repeatedly written what is in the official guide, and still this "urban myth" prevails. Everything appeals to a child at one time or another, including their poopie diaper.!

[Former_Member]

"pastperfect says:

The law has stiff criminal penalties and enforcement has been placed into the hands of the Attorney General of each STATE. This means that a go-getter assistant DA who wants to make a name for himself can go crusading through the state and start bringing Federal charges all in the name of the "safety of our children"! "

This is very true and very unfortunate for those who make and those who enjoy these unique types of items. Most crafters do try to keep safety in mind when creating things for children, but now if they don't label them the way the government wants them to, they get into trouble.

"Ozarknana says:

Problem with this thought is that if the CPSIA THINKS your item can be used/played with by children you will have to comply with all laws pertaining to children's items. It's their call.....just you saying it's "not meant for little kids" isn't going to work with this one...sorry to say... "

The thing is that "may appeal to" contradicts the other part of the verbage in the law and the CPSC's summaries that say that the law only pertains to items "primarily intended for" those 12 and under. They need to pick one and stick to it, for Pete's sake.

[Former_Member]

Marking to read later

[FayeMaloneDesigns]

Again I ask those of you that quote this "appeals to" part of the law. Where are you getting this in any offical writing?

********
Where is this "may appeal to" verbage in any statement by the CPSC? I have searched and can not find it. I have repeatedly written what is in the official guide, and still this "urban myth" prevails. Everything appeals to a child at one time or another, including their poopie diaper.!