Liking DC

[dottiesdream]

To all those who are unsure about DC, "the waters fine" come on in. My sales have increased significantly since I added it.

[OriginalsbyLauren]

Dottie, I have had it since early feb. and have not had a single problem.

The only downside I see is for shops doing custom work that takes more than a week.

I am loving it and my weekly deposits work great for me.

[Twistmo]

The 'custom' issue is a bit of a problem. I do a lot of custom and sometimes it can take several weeks of emails and proofs before the customer finalizes it. Fortunately my volume of sales can handle it ok, but for the smaller shop it might be a real hindrance.

Otherwise, DC is working out fine for me too now that I've gotten use to it.

[PinchtheMuse]

I had to make some really minor adjustments for DC, but so far so good for me.

I am curious though...for the custom shops....

I do some custom work, but as mostly a ready made shop, I have just as much money and time fronted into my shop (inventory =$$ I have already paid and time is in the listings, photos and creation) just like custom order but I am waiting for any one to come and buy not a specific individual for each listing.

I am having a difficult time seeing the difference other than what one is used to.

I have no argument with those that want the money faster, that is just natural. I just don't "know" that business I guess. Maybe because it is fewer turns at a higher price?

Truth is even if you have your money now anyone can initiate a charge back (or heaven forbid, one can mess up a piece and need extra materials to remake) so as a business you have to have some kind of float money in the first place.

Just curious if it is the less turn at bigger $$ amounts or if there is something else I am not understanding with the custom people saying they are incapable of doing orders without that exact buyers money in hand.

[ohmama]

I agree with you Muse, I never understood that either! Always thought float money was part of doing business. Love that term, "float money". It's so true! Unless you're living hand to mouth.

[Twistmo]

I think that may be the way a lot of shops here operate "living hand to mouth" and that's the issue.

[PinchtheMuse]

Well, lol I was just wondering if I was missing something.

I've noodled over this for a bit and the only thing I could come up with is a custom business with a similar $$ volume but over fewer sales would be different. And, of course, have a different cash flow thing going on.

I figure some are "hand to mouth" but allow that may be all aren't.

[Former_Member]

I may live hand to mouth, but I make sure my business doesn't. Sure, I'd love my DC money immediately too, but sometimes I feel that custom shops are blaming Etsy for their own lack of adaptability to structure their budgets appropriately. That's not Etsy's job, that's MY job.

I always set aside "float money" (good term for it, btw); it wouldn't occur to me not to. I pay for shipping and customs materials with this, then get it back when my shop payment amount is deposited.

So much of the controversy with DC makes me ask, "What's the big deal??"

[PinchtheMuse]

Love your armbands Raven. You should get those on a model if at all possible--it would help people visualize the drape etc.

[BethsBannerBoutique]

I've only had DC since August 31, and all of my sales since then have used it! Wonder if they would have purchased when I only used PayPal?

The only downside I see so far is having to wait for your $$. :(

[OriginalsbyLauren]

You don't see supply,or,vintage shops complaining and they have to purchase everything before,they have a buyer

Shops with ready to ship items purchase their splies in advance too

[barnowlprimitives]

I am a shop with all items painted as ordered. Due to the painting and aging process and the time needed to do it right, my lead time is 6-8 weeks. I don't have a problem with "float money". That said, I don't think it's right for Etsy to hold our money until we ship a product. Pay Pal doesn't hold it. If a customer pays with a check, my bank doesn't hold it out of my account until I notify them that it's shipped. I imagine some shops need the money to conduct business. I believe all the shops simply want access to their money when they want it, not when Etsy deems it approprite in the selling process. If charge backs is an issue, require a crest card on file to handle this. That is what Pay Pal does. Or set a limit or require a slush fund to remain in the account.

[PinchtheMuse]

Hi Kristi,

6-8 weeks is a pretty long time to wait, for sure. I was reading some other threads yesterday and seeing some sellers mention that as being a reason they don't use DC. The $$ volume plus the long wait time they have for their customer didn't make DC attractive to them.

Having the CC on file with Etsy is required I think. If you are a geeky nerd and read every line of terms of service like me you will see Etsy reserves the right to implement reserves (slush fund) on an account.

I think Etsy should allow shops to access at least partial, if only for the reason that custom shops are very much part of the Etsy culture.

I have seen many comments along the lines of "PayPal does it or doesn't do it". Credit card processing and PayPal are two different products.

Are people asking Etsy become PayPal or just don't realize what DC is and what PayPal is are two different things that can accomplish the same end goal?

Speaking for myself, I don't want Etsy DC to be PayPal. I do hope DC stays simple and to the point.

[ohmama]

Kristi,
If you consider that your 6 to 8 weeks processing time is not the average, you may be able to look at this from another view point...

Your banks processing time, once the $ reaches them is in addition to this and no doubt contributes to the time wait that comes into play. A customer may think that waiting 6 to 8 weeks is a long time also? I know I would. So, keeping all this in mind remember that once you do ship it, you will start the process and have your funds soon thereafter depending on your bank.

The point is that you would do well to consider that in your case, the big wait is in making your product. I remember in years past, the law on shipping an item that was paid for stated that you had to ship within 24 hours of receiving payment. Not here on etsy, it was a real law. I don't know what it is now but I always thought it made sense to have this time order in place so a customer knew when they could count on their money being spent and the time of arrival with the item. It made sense to me and it still does. So, if you look at it from the customers point of view you will realize it is fair to pay and receive in a timely manner.

And, it is not unreasonable for etsy to enforce that rule of consideration.

[PinchtheMuse]

Painting and such is a lot different--people use the term "like watching paint dry" for a reason, lol.

I think painting is an excellent example of where a shop would struggle with DC, as is. If you do custom paintings you can't know what to paint ahead of time. You can't make the paint dry faster. Most of the physical processing-- there is just no way to make it go faster.

DC could really hinder a shop like that say you get a run of paintings 10-12 in one week when normally you have six.

Then one week after that you get a custom order for a super sized canvas (which artist doesn't buy in bulk and doesn't keep on hand). Normal, reasonable float is "eaten" by the unforseen spike in the other orders so no float to buy the oversized canvas.

DC has changed my timing and cash flow, but it is on a much smaller scale than something like the example above. I guess mostly because I control what is offered as product when.

[barnowlprimitives]

ohmama, so is etsy charging my customer when they place the order or when I ship the order?

As for my lead time, it is what it is. Almost 3,000 customers have been ok with it, so I see no reason to conduct my business any differently. Hand painted custom art takes the time that it takes. I realize that waiting is not ok with everyone. And no one is required to purchase from me. If they like my products they will wait. If they don't they won't.

I am a big supporter of Etsy. I use direct checkout and will continue to do so. I do think that Etsy should hear from sellers about the different experiences that they are experiencing as that is how they will be able to make educated changes to their platform. We are all different and collectively all of our experiences are worth being heard. I know that they cannot please everyone all the time. But if the process that Pay Pal is using to charge and deposit funds into our accounts is working on their platform, it would be nice to see that same process used for DC.

[ohmama]

kristi from barnowlprimitives says

ohmama, so is etsy charging my customer when they place the order or when I ship the order?
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Help me understand this...
If you take a deposit for the order, that is when the customer pays, right? That is what is being held by etsy till you ship the completed project. Or, are you saying that the customer pays in full at the time of the order, and that is what is being held?

Either way, the customer does not get the item till you ship it. And once it is shipped, you can have your money from etsy. Depending on how your business works, that is, if you have them pay everything up front, or if you have them give a deposit, whatever that amount is will be held till the product is made and shipped. Do you feel this is the wrong way for etsy to do it? Why does etsy do it this way? Is it to insure that the customer will get the item? Is there some legal rules about why etsy does it this way that we don't know about?

From reading your previous post it sounds like you want etsy to release the funds to you at the start and allow you to ship in 6 to 8 weeks. Is that right? There seem to be a lot of complaints on this same issue and I would be curious to find out if it changes in the near future.

[barnowlprimitives]

Pay pal does not hold funds until a product is shipped. It's available for deposit depending on the method of funding (credit card, check, account balance). If my customer doesn't have a problem paying me up front for my work, I should have access to my funds as soon as they are cleared. I realize depending on the day and taking into account holidays and bank closures, etc that time could be a few business days.

If there is a legal reason, I'd like to hear it. If an Etsy admin can direct us to a detailed explanation, I would love to read it.

[ohmama]

All good points. Okay etsy, answer this please. We would all like to know the reason behind the decision.

[Former_Member]

I just signed up and have had two credit card sales. So far, great!. The last sale was one customer who bought 5 sad irons. I have to think on how to ship those!