Former_Member
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dyeing silk problems

Well, I bought a pretty sheer silk to make a dress with. When it arrived, it was a lighter color than I wanted, so I decided to dye it. The fiber content listed was 100% silk, I did an acid food coloring type process, more or less boiling the silk for an hour or so, and let the water cool off for a couple hours with the silk still in. I was dying, and kept adding color as it did not seem to be quite the right color, it was not seeming to be dark enough.
I took it out, let it dry, and indeed it was not quite right - it still had the bright silvery sheen that I wanted to dull into a blue tone. So I looked closer - and was very surprised to realise that all the thin threads going in one direction had dyed very well, they were a nice blue, but all of the thin threads going in the opposite way were still the light shade they were before dying. The fabric also has a sort of plaid type pattern of thick threads, which very slightly changed shade.
So I am rather lost - what now? I did a burn test to try to find out what fiber it is, and from that I am pretty sure I am not dealing with a synthetic. Would there be a finish on the silk that would prevent it from dyeing, or am I right in assuming that I may have a half cotton fabric... anyone else run into this...
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Former_Member
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Re: dyeing silk problems

Take a tiny piece of your fabric and let it sit in some bleach for a while--half an hour, at least. If it's 100% silk, it will dissolve completely. If not, threads will be left over. This is the most fail-proof way I know of to verify that something is 100% silk. (Note: This process will dissolve any protein fiber, so it won't help with silk vs. wool, but that's usually not a difficult distinction to make.)
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GoodNiteGracie
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Re: dyeing silk problems

What a great idea, Shoeless! I learn something new everyday. I was thinking that maybe if they were both silk threads, that the one that is not taking color has some type of finish (sizing) on it. I used to do batik and made a point of ordering fabric from a company that sold untreated fabric, so there were never any surprises when dyeing.
Gracie
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Former_Member
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Re: dyeing silk problems

thanks so much!
I will give the bleach a try and see what happens!
Anyone know what to do if it is all silk?
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Former_Member
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Re: dyeing silk problems

If it is all silk, the non-dyed threads could still have sericin (worm spit) coating it. That should have gone away in the dyeing process, hot acidic water usually does the trick.

If it's *not* silk, you'll want to find out what that other thread is. Separate some of it out and burn it. Does it smell like burning paper? Probably rayon, and you'll need to use a fiber reactive dye (which will dye silk as well, though not as vividly as an acid dye will. Also, the soda ash used is hard on silk, so go easy on it.)

If it's a synthetic, you might be screwed. If that's the case, I recommend fabric from Dharma Trading http://www.dharmatrading.com . Several of their silks are sheer (some *very* sheer), they're generally inexpensive, and they're really, truly, 100% no kidding silk.
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Former_Member
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Re: dyeing silk problems

Wow, I was just ckecking dharma trading out, I have never seen silk so cheap. I will look there next time I need any. I absolutely hate polyester, so when I am making a fancy dress I need silk. Cotton just doesn't look so, well, fancy. I am hoping to do the bleach test tonight. Perhaps I will buy some fiber reactive dye and do my next batch of color in hopes of that dyeing the rest of the fabric...
Would a fiber reactive dye work if it was just sizing or sericin? I did boil it for at least a half hour, stirring almost constantly in a pot of water that had a cup or two of vinegar....
excuse my ignorance in the area of dyes... but how is soda ash hard on silk? does it dissolve it or weaken it or make the finish less glossy....?
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Former_Member
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Re: dyeing silk problems


excuse my ignorance in the area of dyes... but how is soda ash hard on silk? does it dissolve it or weaken it or make the finish less glossy....?
---

Yes.

Soda ash is basic, just like bleach is, but not as strong. It's necessary for using fiber reactive dyes (it makes the "reaction" happen), but it's not great on the silk. It's just like bleaching your hair: You get the color you want (theoretically), but the strength and texture have been permanently changed. Slightly. It won't be as obvious a change with soda ash as with bleach, but you should know that you are damaging the fiber, though in a small way. (So: when possible, use acid dyes with silk, if you must use fiber reactive, know that the fabric will be slightly more delicate after.)

If it's just sizing, a fiber reactive dye *might* work, if it's from a cellulosic base. I honestly don't know much about how sericin takes dye. Theoretically, it'll be a protein compound like silk is, and would take the acid dye. But if that were the case, you wouldn't be having the problem you're having. It's honestly more likely to be a synthetic of some sort, either polyester or rayon.

The highlights:
Protein fibers (Wool, silk, hair, etc) require acid dyes, are slightly strengthened by acids, and are weakened/destroyed by bases.

Cellulosic fibers (cotton, linen, rayon, hemp) require fiber reactive dyes, are slightly strengthened by bases, and are weakened/destroyed by acids.

Synthetic fibers (Polyester, nylon, acrylic) have all their own rules, are generally resistant to acids/bases, smell like burning plastic when burned, and are difficult to dye. (Exception: Nylon takes acid dyes nicely)

Edited to add: Because you've boiled it for a good long time, it's unlikely to be either sericin or sizing. Either one should have come out by now.
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Former_Member
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Re: dyeing silk problems

Thanks! I am quite new to this and don't yet have the instinct to just figure it out.
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Former_Member
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Re: dyeing silk problems

Don't feel bad, I'm not going on instinct, I've actually had classes in this subject. MA, Textiles, Clothing and Design.
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Former_Member
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Re: dyeing silk problems

Well,
I did the bleach test, and all the fibers/threads that colored dissoled in a couple minutes, all the ones that stayed white remained unchanged.
I contacted the company and they are sending me a refund for the fabric, and I am trying to cut down a huge shopping cart of fabrics and dyes from Dharma Trading. Trying very hard to decide what I actually NEED... do I really need to buy all the intersting looking silks... or should I just pick one... but which should I pick... and then which types of dye should I try first and what colors do I really want?
But it is a good problem to have now!
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