Etsy Listing Deactivated: Prohibited Items

[HKsportswear]

Got this notice from Etsy with a lot of vague threats about removing my star seller rating and possibly deactivating my store if I don't comply.  Problem is, I'm not sure exactly what the issue is.  I think it might have been from some images of native Americans that I had as design elements that can be used in our custom baseball jerseys.  

However, it is not clear that was the issue - there is mention of not selling native American crafts that weren't made by anyone other than a native.  And there was a link to an article about native Americans as sports mascots but there was no actual copy that said this was against the policies. 

So I did remove ALL the images of native Americans from my design options from every listing and I took all the listings down that were similar to this original one until I heard word back. I also wrote back and asked for further clarification and they said I need to contact Etsy Legal.  So I did that and Etsy legal said I need to contact trust-and-safety (the original department).  So I wrote back and again explained the situation and my confusion and Gladys wrote back and again provided a bunch of links about intellectual property and the prohibited items policy.   So I read those all again and I'm still not seeing that I'm in any violation.  

I did see one sentence in bold

Please review your listings and ensure that you are not making use of any third-party Intellectual Property Rights including the brand’s name, logos, product or character names, copyrighted content, or protected designs without the owner’s authorization.

None of my products fall into this category.  What am I missing here?  All my products are designed for each customer by my designers or I.  We do use artwork for team mascots that are generic and can be used as part of the design, but again I purchased the license to these designs and they are only part of the final product such as a font would be.  

Any thoughts?  This is starting to feel like dealing with Amazon. 

[UniqueGiftOrnaments]

I don't know if buyers want you to put the name of the school mascot or team, but I believe we cannot use them unless we get permission from the schools. If you have license, make a note of it. Be beware, people who sell license for an item may not be legitimate. There have been a number of posts of sellers purchasing an item stating they had license to do so, but had the items taken down for infringement.

[RamenSandwich]

Yes, sports team names and logos — certainly NCAA and professional — are trademarked.

[HKsportswear]

Here's the message I send out to anyone asking me to reproduce trademarked images or logos - my # 3 top saved reply after sizing and questions about turnaround.

"Sorry, but we do not reproduce copyrighted materials unless it can be proven that you are the holder of the copyright. Doing so would violate our terms of service with Etsy and would terminate our agreement with Etsy."

[RamenSandwich]

@HKsportswear More to the point, trademark would be the issue. Trademark and copyright are different things.

[RamenSandwich]

After looking at your shop, I can make a confident guess at the issue: In your shop banner, you use names of actual team names that are trademarked. Unless you have permission from the trademark holder, that's a violation of intellectual property rights.

"Golden Knights." That's the NHL team in Las Vegas, and for sure they have trademarked the name. Do you know the story about why they're called the Golden Knights? Originally, the owner wanted to call them the Black Knights, but the U.S. Military Academy held the trademark for using Black Knights as a sports team name because their NCAA football team is... the Army Black Nights.

Nebraska and Ole Miss in this context are probably also trademark violations. Especially Ole Miss, because you never hear that nickname used for anything other than the University of Mississippi.

If you used a sports mascot depicting a Native American, I'll bet the Native American-ness is not the issue. The issue is that you used something trademarked by someone else.

[CeliaOKelleyJewelry2]

I agree with this. You are using trademarked images and logos to sell your product. You  may not be selling these actual items, but to even use these images anywhere in the shop without a license to use the logos, is against the law. Try and redo the banner and see if that makes a difference.

[HKsportswear]

Good points.  I should probably google everything that comes across my order page.  I honestly wasn't aware that Las Vegas had a Hockey Team.  Go figure.  You cannot trademark a name of a state or country.  You are allowed to reproduce trademarked words as parody and some common team names are up for grabs - words Like Cubs, Bears, Beavers, etc are allowed as long as they are not violating the look, style and images.  The images we used were purchased from our supplier of our heatset vinyl material and are fully intended for use in sportswear manufacturing and design.  Though to avoid any legal stepping on toes or ruffling feathers, we have removed every single image and option having to do with any of these images.  Sorry kids, you'll have to go with the No Names or The Nothings until someone trademarks those names.

[RamenSandwich]

@HKsportswear Well... are you sure your supplier knows what he's doing in terms of providing images that can be used? Because from the text of the notice you received from Etsy, it sure sounds like use of trademarked images without permission is the issue here.

The Las Vegas Golden Knights came into the NHL about five seasons ago, made it to the Stanley Cup Finals their first year. So they're not really obscure. If you're going to be doing this, it might be good to make a quick study of the names and logos of major professional sports league teams and NCAA teams. If you get any customers from the UK, Premiere League football clubs as well — they're known to be very aggressive in enforcing their trademarks.

[CostumeCoutureNaomi]

Deleted.

So weird.  I posted in another thread but my post appeared in this one.  

[PlatypusDream]

Vintage images of "American Indians" (First Nations) in traditional headdresses are considered racist by many people.

It is against Etsy's rules to sell items with racist images (Washington Redskins, Chief Wahoo, Little Black Sambo).

This may be the problem.

I noticed that your banner has a round logo with a bear head (read: "Cubs") that might be too close for comfort for Etsy.

Etsy will pull items that look like obvious counterfeits / knock off of famous team merchandise.  Even using the image of a hockey jersey with the words "Golden Knights" is VERY risky.

[PrimFun]

Do any of your photos have iconic names or designs?

The Native American is explained in Our House Rules.  Native Americans may continue to make items others cannot under the terms of their relationship with the US and Canada governments.

I found one photo that has Indians on it.  That word cannot be used for sports teams.  If you have one for Redskinss team that's the same problem.  You may need have to go through the photos and remove any that no longer allow the name to be used because it is considered  racist.

When you purchased the designs did you purchase a license for the way you are going to use it.  If these mascots are trademarked (and that includes design) then you can't use them.

This sounds more complicated that really can be answered here.

I suggest you talk to a sports lawyer and get their advice about this.  You may need licensing.   Have you seen the commercial for sports apparel and they say they have licenses to use the names.  Yours is not the same issue exactly could come close.

I really think a lawyer can help here. 

[HKsportswear]

Thank you for your input - I thought I did remove every single image I could find of native americans (Indians).  Where are you seeing an image?

[BagmakerSupply]

@PrimFunmakes a very good point, you are definitely in an area where a knowledgeable intellectual property lawyer may be a requirement, particularly if you are willing to put a trademarked team name or copyrighted logo on the shirt. But be warned that just because you are in the right does not mean that some bot will not deactivate a listing or that it will be reactivated when it is reviewed.

[RamenSandwich]

Here's one possibility that might complicate things, and where I would agree that it's a good idea to consult an intellectual property lawyer: Do you get orders from youth league sports teams to print up their uniforms? In the US, a lot of youth league teams use the names of actual major league teams. I assume that their league has the proper permissions from the trademark holder, or that there is no point in going after them because they operate as not for-profit enterprises (Little League Baseball is a tax-exempt charity, for instance).

Suppose a youth league team with permission to use a team name and logo — the My Neighborhood Dodgers, let's say — comes to you and says, "We'd like you to print up our team uniforms." Would you be violating trademark if you took the job? I honestly don't know.

As far as Etsy goes, though, @BagmakerSupply makes a good point: Etsy often uses automation to detect possible violations, and it's a quick process but also very sloppy. You could be on solid ground, with all your permissions in place, and they could still put the burden on you to prove that your legitimate. It's a hassle when that happens, especially with Etsy support being as slow as it is.

[HKsportswear]

You cannot obtain a copyright registration for one word. Copyright does not protect names, titles, slogans, or short phrases. A copyright only exists for original works of authorship fixed in a tangible medium of expression.  But attempting to reproduce a design or trademark for a like or similar product is not allowed.  I doubt a youth team would have the permission to use a team name and logo but you would have to be very careful in how the design was implemented.  If you tried to copy the font, colors, etc of the Dodgers, then you would have a problem.  

[RamenSandwich]

@HKsportswear Those youth league teams that do this use the logo and font. That's why I think it's an interesting question.

[RamenSandwich]

@HKsportswear And in any event, we're not talking about copyright so much as trademark. Again, if you're going to be dealing in this area you're going to have to know the difference.

[BrimstoneHillDesigns]

I posted a counted cross stitch pattern from the 80's ("vintage" and "supply" categories) of MLB teams, which had Kansas City and Washington's original team names and logos, and Etsy took it down and sent a strongly worded email saying it was racist. 

[RamenSandwich]

MLB or NFL? I don't see how Royals would be considered racist, and Washington didn't even have an MLB team in the '80's. The Senators were still the Montreal Expos then.

[BelaPonyi]

Etsy deactivated all my led product, and none of my creations comes or are sold with batteries the batteries that are used are not coin-operated, and my item was still deactivated. No warnings. Just removed, and cant is undone. BUTTTTT. All the big-led battery-operated companies are still up and running on Etsy.

A new policy was uploaded on June 9th. After June< many people lost all their led handmade products except the larger seller companies. Etsy only went after the smaller people. Even if you have no coin batteries and even if you don't send, sell and ship batteries, you will still be on Etsy generated list to go after any names that have the word led or battery in it. We have all been targeted. I emailed and had them call me everything until I finally got a real answer. The kelp said, "You violated policy," then someone finally sent me an email saying it was my handmade battery-operated led products. Now I am stuck with over 3000 inventory or parts, tools, and products. What's funny was that someone from Etsy reinstated my led products, then they were all removed three weeks later like it was a game to them.

[YOUHaveBeenMOOd]

Here’s a refined version of your statement:

Etsy promotes its site while turning a blind eye to copyright infringement, effectively advertising and enabling the sale of infringing merchandise. Despite their claims of protecting intellectual property, Etsy allows copyright-infringing products to be listed and sold, only acting when a complaint is filed by the copyright owner or a third-party brand protection service. This approach not only undermines creators but also encourages customers to purchase infringing items, contributing to a marketplace where genuine intellectual property rights are often overlooked.

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