Been trying to get a hold of Trust&Safety for over a month now to no avail

[DwarvenArmoryStore]

Hello, 

This is my first time using the forums, but I'm literally out of options right now. 

So the story is simple, Etsy removed my shop from search results twice since June, it appears as soon as I hit 9 sales I get the automatic email from Trust&Safety about removing my shop from search results to allow me to catch up. 

The first time it was resolved, showing Etsy that we can easily handle 9 open orders, matter of fact we can handle way more as there's 3 employees working full time here. 

I thought this was over with, until in early August it happened again. 

Tried multiple times to get to talk with a representative from Trust&Safety, and the only communication I got was over over one month ago, they said something about 10 overdue orders, which we NEVER had, since this shop exists we shipped everything in due time, no delays, all tracked and customers reviews are there to testify. 

Yet this keeps happening and after that they simply refused to talk to me anymore, been ignoring my emails and support request for over a month and a half. 

We currently have but a few open orders, no one of them is expired and by the way, we put the processing time for a reason, we craft things that take weeks to be produced, but never we had any delay in the process. 

Now we're sitting with over a month and a half with little to no income besides some orders I can funnel in from social media, and Etsy simply refuses to take a look into it, all we get is bot like messages to wait 7 days, that was 30 days ago. 

If I speak to the live chat they keep saying someone will reach out to us via email, yet nothing happens, and we cannot call anyone as that's a US service only. 

Has anyone got the same problem? How can I get to talk to someone who can actually understand our issue here? 

I'm definitely getting frustrated, cause we cannot keep a business operational like this, specially with no explanation given, we're left in the dark completely. 

I appreciate any heads up

[OneEyeCatStudio]

I see your listings.

Are you sure there have been no trademark or copyright infringement issues?

IBN

[DwarvenArmoryStore]

Yes  the shop isn't suspended, but we don't show up in search results, shops operational but all the views we get are from my own social media posts and ad campaigns that I'm paying for, we're completely cut off from Etsy's search results 

[OneEyeCatStudio]

Yes, I see that.
Your shop has been de-indexed, which is something Etsy frequently does when they are investigating infringement cases.
Which is why I asked if there had been any mention of that.

[DwarvenArmoryStore]

Oh no mention of that, they mentioned 10 overdue orders that we never had, hence why my confusion about it, they told us the same thing back on June, and then after we got reindexed it happened again in August, same email, saying that we had 10 overdue orders, and now I'm still trying to figure out why, it's so frustrating

[NanaLetha]

your shop is not indexed. You need to contact Etsy support and request they index your shop.

[DwarvenArmoryStore]

Yes, that's what I'm trying to, actually been trying for more than a month now, but the only reply I got was an empty email and another one saying that we had to wait up to 7 days, and that was 30 days ago, I'm completely lost

[hopeandjoystudios]

Go here and at the bottom click Still need help>. Submit a request – Etsy Help

Some have said to try to keep replying to the same help request as if you start a new one it will drop you to the back of the line again. 

[DwarvenArmoryStore]

I've done that, even got the customer support team to escalate it to high priority, but it seems almost impossible to get a hold of someone from trust and safety, Hopefully someone will step in at some point and give me at least pointers as to why this happened twice since June, for the same reason which was totally not true, it seems that as soon as we hit 8/9 orders we get this

[hopeandjoystudios]

It is probably that your items are higher dollar. I assume after so many orders that have been made X days ago and not shipped and Y$$$$ that it somehow sets off an auto de index. Which it should NOT if you have correct processing times and are not missing shipping dates or pushing them out...but..Etsy. They are covering their a$$ incase a seller with high dollar orders in the works suddenly flaked. I think they took a beating during the "pandemic mask fiasco" with sellers taking thousands of orders they had no time or even materials to complete and just closing shop and running... so everyone else has to now pay the price.

[DwarvenArmoryStore]

Yeah it's definitely that. 

We have 6/8 weeks processing time and shipping time both listed on each item, they are accurate and mostly longer than it really needs, we ship everything in a two weeks time frame anyways, some even quicker, specially if there's 3 people working full time and we give them proof of our work ethic I find it ridiculous, it forces us to crank our orders out quicker just to stay indexed, which can definitely results in quality drop

[RamenSandwich]

Well, there are potential trademark issues because you use proper names from Lord of the Rings and A Game of Thrones in your titles. Etsy may have caught that and de-indexed you as a result.

[DwarvenArmoryStore]

They would've said so if it was that, instead they mentioned overdue orders and avoiding backlog, so they delisted us to catch up 

[UppNorthCo]

@DwarvenArmoryStore  - you are expecting logic.  there is no logic or transparency from etsy in these instances.

[PlatypusDream]

@DwarvenArmoryStore 

Etsy is known for being non-communicative with regards to IP infringement because of their Safe Harbour status.

They can de-index you, place you on vacation mode, put a reserve on your shop funds and throttle your listings if they suspect you are selling illegal (unlicensed) counterfeit materials.

From their Prohibited Items policy:

https://www.etsy.com/ca/legal/prohibited/

"Unauthorised replicas or copies of items are prohibited on Etsy. We consider counterfeit or unauthorised goods to be items that imitate an authentic good, particularly by using a brand’s name, logo, or protected design without the brand owner’s consent. "

You are making reproductions of designs from the Game of Thrones series and using character names.  I see no proof of authorization or legal licensing... therefore, one could assume you are producing counterfeit items.

[DwarvenArmoryStore]

I'd be more than happy to change the names, I've done that in the past from other types of stuff which are notoriously to be more sensitive about copyright infringement,  if Etsy told me so

[RamenSandwich]

@DwarvenArmoryStore Etsy expects you to be a grown-up and know about that stuff already. It's a no-brainer to understand that violating someone else's intellectual property rights is a policy violation. It's that way everywhere you sell.

In your case, it may be trademark and the names — but it could also be copyright because it looks like you're specifically copying objects from the Peter Jackson movies (I've never watched AGoT, so I can't speak to that). The risk to you goes beyond being de-indexed by Etsy, it's about possible civil and criminal legal issues if you don't have the proper merchandise licenses.

[DwarvenArmoryStore]

I'll take my chances then, if that's the case Etsy should ban all cosplay makers on the website, anyone who sells replicas, 3d files, anything, yet here we are. 

This is definitely not the case, as I have the email I got in front of me, but okay I guess? 

[RamenSandwich]

@DwarvenArmoryStore Chapter and verse of Etsy policy has already been cited for your benefit, but if you want to be stupid, I guess that's your business. I've been participating in forums like this for 20 years, and I wish I had a buck for every whine I've seen about, "There are plenty of sellers doing the same thing as me." I could buy Jeffrey Epstein's island with the money.

The only authoritative guide to what is permitted on a site like Etsy is the rules as written, not what everyone else is doing. Etsy doesn't vet listings, so policy violations are live and publicly visible until caught. Etsy announced earlier this year that they were going to tighten the screws on policy enforcement. From what I've been able to tell from following this forum, they're doing more than they have in the past, but the problems are so vast and varied that it will take a while to a handle on it.

And by the way, this seems to include sneaky stuff like denying Seller Protection and suppressing search placement for certain policy violations (including probably IP infringement) without any real warning. Let us not forget that you are the one who is complaining that you have been de-indexed for no (apparent) good reason. I'm pointing out that there is a good reason based on the site rules and what Etsy seems to have been doing lately, even if it isn't the reason that Etsy gave you in their pre-fab notice.

[DwarvenArmoryStore]

Yet they talked about 10 overdue orders specifically, to me that's more than clearly the reason, what I'm trying to say is that we never had these orders they mentioned, and the first time we got reinstated as soon as the last order was completed, what I'm trying to figure out is why would a shop be determined on backlog for low sales like 8/9 orders

[AAANativeArts]

The Chat is useless, so don't even bother with that. They are workers in a 3rd world country reading from a script, and if your qustion isn't on the script they say they will forward up the chain, which opens a new inquiry, which goes to the back of the line of waiting queries.

Go to Community&Help=>Help and choose a question, any question, and scroll to the bottom of the answer and click the I Still Need Help link and tell them what your problem is. If you have already contacted them and gotten a reply that did not solve your problem, scroll to the bottom of that email and click I Still Need Help. When you get a canned response that does not answer your question, scroll to the bottom and click I Still Need Help and explain your problem again. They may send you several responses that don't answer your question, but just keep doing that and eventually a real human will read it and answer. They often send canned responses 2 or 3 times before that happens. With up to 10 days waiting for them to answer between each inquiry.

Don't start a new email chain, or they will close the first inquiry and move the new inqury to the back of the line waiting for answers, and then it all starts again.

We all agree that Etsy Help sucks, but that is what we've got.

[DwarvenArmoryStore]

Thank you for answer, I'll definitely try and do that

[DwarvenArmoryStore]

Under that email there's no "I still need help option to click, is it on the email itself? Or on the requests from the help center which I can comment on? 

[JDTotesnDolls]

Take one email from Etsy and reply back that the shop is not indexed.  Keep sending that email daily.  Reiterate the shop is not indexed.  You are selling nothing that is prohibited.  That your items are made of EVA and not real metal.  That your items are for cosplay.

BTW change your shop policies so they are EU compliant.  I wonder if that may be triggering something as well considering the cost of your items.

And be careful about using words that are trademarked like Lord of the Rings.

[DwarvenArmoryStore]

Will do, by the way what should be EU compliant policies? They don't give me any speficic option in that section

thank you for your help by the way!