Help with Tags

[freelandfolkartsigns]

Hello all,

My views are always really low, although I have had some sales so I am very grateful for this. I was wondering if someone may be able to take a look at my shop to give me ideas on how I may be able to be found on on the internet? I have changed tags around in the past but unfortunately this hasn't helped at all.

Thanks much!

Heather

[Former_Member]

Hey Heather.
I have taken a look and have a couple of thoughts that I need to formulate so an answer makes sense.
Anyone else want to look and compare notes?
This really is a good question.
But at my house it is supper time so I'll be back later.

I by the way looked at this product listing, strictly arbitrarily for comparison purposes.

http://www.etsy.com/listing/102861379/well-behaved-women-rarely-make-history

[Former_Member]

Evening Heather. Supper is done and I can concentrate on your question. But before I start you must accept that this is one mans opinion and a response to your question. It may not be the absolute best response or maybe even the one you want to hear but I think I am right so I am going to express it.

Here is your question:
Heather from thesignpost says
==================
Hello all,

My views are always really low, although I have had some sales so I am very grateful for this. I was wondering if someone may be able to take a look at my shop to give me ideas on how I may be able to be found on on the internet? I have changed tags around in the past but unfortunately this hasn't helped at all.

Thanks much!

Heather
=================
And if I carefully reword this question to get to what I think is the meat of the problem, it sounds like this.
My Views are really low. How can I be found on the internet?

And if I am correct with this assumption and you came to a tag team (hi there glad to see you) to try to figure out what to do than you must realize the function of a tag.
As stated many times it is where a search program looks rather than the description on Etsy. Thus what ever the description describes and attempts to paint a verbal picture of, the tags (along with the title) should functionally define what ever it is that your are selling.

And keeping in mind this, a most important part of the equation. A search engine processes search requests made by a person that is looking for something.
A person looking for something creates a verbal picture that describes what they want to a search engine and the search engine then goes into the internet or into an assigned portion of the internet to match the words up that a person wrote and presented to it, to words found (on Etsy in this case because it is an Etsy Search Engine) in product listings which are formulated by a person selling something thus creating a verbal picture that is matched by the search engine to the search request and then a list of things that matched those words is prepared and presented.
And where on those product listings do the search engine look?
The Title
and the
Tags
Which are a function of this team.


So Think about this for a moment. The tags (with the title) must create a verbal picture of a product listing that is the same verbal picture created by reading the description on the listing along with the Title.

So looking at this listing:
http://www.etsy.com/listing/102861379/well-behaved-women-rarely-make-history

With this Title:
Well Behaved Women Rarely Make History Funny Women distressed primitive country wall hanging wood sign
And this product description:
A funny women quote stenciled sign reading Well Behaved Women Rarely Make History. A cute wood sign reminding us that some of the world's most memorable women were not perfect. This sign measures approximately 6" x 26" long and is pictured here in Ebony stain with Linen colored Acrylic lettering. This sign was made out of knotty pine. We believe that the knots and imperfections associated with knotty pine give the piece a more rustic look. We sand the edges of the sign to give it a more rustic look but if you would prefer not to have the edges sanded just let me know. All of our signs are protected with a Matte finish.

When ordering, please specify in note section which color you would like. If you do not specify a color, I will assume you want the piece in the color as pictured in the first picture.

I have to ask this question.
If I were looking for something like this what is it I would call it and even more so, what did you call it.

so lets go look at the tags. As they are important as they should create the same verbal picture when read as the description does.

Tags:
Woodworking Sign
inspirational sign
stained sign
primitive sign
country sign
wood sign
gift sign
sign
laurel Ulrich sign
women sign
well behaved women rustic sign seldom make history
laurel thatcher

Now if I look at the description and attempt to write out what I see as a verbal picture I see in my picture a wooden sign in black and linen colored lettering and it is rustic. The lettering will define some form of a humorous comment as to women.

Now as I look at the tags what comes to mind is some kind of a wooden sign.

And not much else.
The Point? The tags and the description don’t match.
Now as you use pretty much the same description through out your listings and probably similar tags, the comment probably reflects product listings in your shop.

What specific is wrong?
Well for the first observation there are way too many words in the total tag content and the length of the Title.
Why is that important.
Go back and read some of the other answers by me, this is covered over and over again and if you have questions I will answer a direct question. I am just too tired to rewrite that information over again.
One of the problems with the number of words is the multiple repeats of the word sign.
There are 11 repeats. There is both a good and bad to that. The Good is this.
IF and the operative word is IF the word sign is used as a search term the 11 matches count very high as to placement decisions as to where this listing might be as compared to other listings found.
But keep in mind the total number of words used in the combination of the Title and Tags that may not match any of the words used to search with will point way down the toilet as to placement in comparison to something that is listed using fewer words.

It depends on the phrasing of the search used to find this product with. And you say it is not being found. You say but you give no examples of what it looks like not being found. Probably because you don’t have any and that is o.k. because I am going to fabricate some searches.
I do that so you can look at them and see what is going on. A picture is worth a thousand words. So let me restate this, your verbal picture is almost nothing.
So what is it that you expect this to be looked for with?
Because when visually seen it is quite a nice looking piece of something, the problem is what is the something it is.
Why can I say that?
Because I too am a wood worker. I am pretty fair and I have a garage full of tools most of which I am pretty fair on knowing how to use them.
look at some of my work!

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.249221808422966.73636.100000054477839&type=1&l=95356a38fc


Do you know what to call these things?
I do
Furniture
A rocking chair or two
A restored or re-conditioned Murphy Rocker, 170 years old. Or the other chair is an early 20th century rocking chair with a read woven seat and a caned back.

But what is the thing you are making?

Your description tells a lot about the material and the method used to make the product. And that is interesting and the description is a good place to put it but almost nothing about what it actually is.
Other than implying is a wooden humorous wall hanging.
Now granted that is a bit of nit picking but face it, unless this product is run across accidently while possible entertaining yourself by browsing the way it is titled or tagged, some one looking for this product would never find it.
Remember this, your are selling a product. A tangible piece of representative work, not a knot hole a piece of pine or a finishing technique or even an observation as to is appearance. If you can not touch it or feel it you are not selling it.

So lets try a search for wall decor.
Why Wall Decor?
There is a reason for using it. The reason is we need a starting place to call this thing something that is in the system that may be recognized.
Now I can go through a listing process and find out what recommendations are but so can you.
I went to the Buy Page, the Categories section and under Wood Working AND the Housewares was the term Wall decor.
So it is an Etsy term.
Do I think this is the best way to go? That is not under discussion. It is a systematic way to go for the purpose of this answer using Etsy recognized terms.
So if I were to use a categories based search request in the general search bar I would start with HouseWares and Wall Decor.

So the Search:

Housewares (one word not two) Wall Decor, Wood, humor, women

Now what I did as to identify what I want to look for and where I expect to find it.
Something made from wood that I can hang on a wall that will pick on women in a humorous fashion.

Housewares, Wall Decor, Wood, humor, women
These are words that I think have a high PROBABILITY of being found in the Title and Tags of a wooden sign listed for sale somewhere that humorously picks on women.
http://www.etsy.com/search?q=Housewares%2C%20Wall%20Decor%2C%20Wood%2C%20humor%2C%20women&view_type=...

Only 4 items. Not very many! Well it is my search and I found what I asked for. But keep this in mind. You made one of these signs and the search matched my search terms to some ones listing terms and did find 4 items and yours was NOT one of them.
So why did you not use some of these words in titles or tags when you created the listing rather than repeating the word sign 11 time. That is a waste of space.

But I want to see more than 4 items so I get so change my search.
and the first word I will change is Wall Decor.
Why? Because frankly I think there is a higher probability of find things listed as wall hangings rather than wall decore. The reason? Never mind, it is one of the reason I personally never use categoris.
Second search
Housewares. Wall Hanging, wood, humor, women.
http://www.etsy.com/search?q=Housewares.%20Wall%20Hanging%2C%20wood%2C%20humor%2C%20women&view_type=...

Well I was wrong, only 2 items, today Wall Decor was a better choice than Wall Hanging but when you are searching that is what synonyms are for.

so this time I am going to use sign.

http://www.etsy.com/search?q=Housewares%20sign%20%20wood%20%20humor%20%20women&view_type=gallery&shi...

Well this was better, 8 items it is now a beginning for me anyway.
But there is a point to be made here and you need to be aware of it.
One of the functions of tags is to include synonyms as a tag so if different searches are made using synonyms of words due to colloquialisms or geographical differences such as countries they potentially broaden your market visibility. Again, Wall Decor, Wall Hanging and sign are all appropriate tags for your product but you instead repeated sign 11 times. Again, what a waste of space.

This listing looks like one of yours so I went to look at it. Remember this, if as a result of A search one of your listings show up, that listing is a side door entrance to your shop to let people pick and choose to look at others.

you should go look at it too and look at it’s tags. It showed on my search and the object of my search to find something that represented the mental or verbal picture of a product from your shop. But nothing showed up from your shop.
The reason nothing showed up is that your listings do not cover the PROBABILITY of different wording used to create a search request.
If I am looking for a product I will create a verbal picture of the things I want to see on the list of found items by my search. Frankly that is exactly what happened.
The eight items showed up do represent more or less what I expect to have show up.
How ever nothing from your shop showed up.
I wanted to see a wooden sign that presented a humorous definition of a women. And I got that.
Nothing in your shop is listed that way.

So lets remove the word women and see what shows up.
The search
Housewares. sign, wood, humor,

Now I am staying in housewares. Why? Because wall hangings are a houseware item, just like furniture is.
Woodworking is a method of making signs and furniture and I am not looking to buy a method of making something. I am looking for the end product.
Something used in a house.
http://www.etsy.com/search?q=Housewares%20sign%20%20wood%20%20humor%20&order=most_relevant&view_type...

Now there are a list of 6 pages of humorous signs made of wood that can be hung on a wall in a house
210 individual items.
I am not going to look at all 6 pages simply because I don’t want to. I never look past 4 pages when I go to find what I want to find because I message the search program to give me what I am looking for so I don’t have to look much past the 1st 3 pages. But you need to look.
Because I think nothing from your shop is there. Why?
Because I am sure that rather than using synonyms you used another variation of the word sign which is doing you no good at all and things from your shop will not be found.

your descriptions are not bad, most people write a good description and then ignore them and you did too. You are getting carried away with how you make a sign. You are not selling a method of making a sign. You are selling the end result.
You need to clean up your descriptions so they primarily represent the product. The seconday information is how you make them and it IS a good read, but it IS NOT important to being found.
Then when you deal with your tags see to it that the tags say what the description does as to what the product is.
And then include synonyms that have a high PROBABILITY of being used to find something with.
You do not have to increase the word count of the Titles and Tags by writing out the message on your sign.
1st reason, you created the saying. How do you expect me to guess what it was you created? I can’t and adding those words in the title is HIGH VALUE VERBAL DIARREA.. Simply state the intent of the saying and something brief as to the subject.
Most people that is the closest they are going to be able to match using a search engine to find things with. And for heavens sake do not assume you can guess what search I am going to use and try to build a listing around it.
You have no idea how I am going to look for something and there are 40,000,000 of us a month coming around and looking and bloody few of us find things.
Why do you think that is happening?
Maybe bloody poor search methods and poor listing methods. Such as 11 repeats of the word sign with no reference at all using alternative words that may say the same thing.
Go Back and look at that one sign found. The word sign was only there once but my search found it!!! not yours.
So Sad.

O.k., this is a lot of information and I hope somehow it is helpful. Please pay some attention to parts of it because you know something, these are well done products and I am sure that if some one is even looking something remotely similar, they will stop and look and PROBABLY buy one.
And they will get good value for the money they spend.
Hope I helped, and if you feel the same, come back if you want to ask a question.