When will all this be policed

[Former_Member]

I have basically quit making children's items because of all these changes but yet in the market place where I have my store they keep selling everything and anything that is not in compliance. Junk from China that is most definitely not in compliance and new items with no labels or made with whatever they feel like. Some have the painted buttons that have lead in them because I have some of them also. It is alarming to see these items being sold to the public when you know they do not meet the standards of the CPSIA and could be harmful to the children.. But no one polices this and the lead just keeps going on and on. We worry sooo much about being in compliant but then others just blow it off. If no one is going to police this then what is the point. Our children will still not be safe


JMO
LInda

[LeafandYard]

I don't think anyone is going to actively go into every store and make sure they are complying. They rely on people like you who see it happening and report the violators to them. After they get a report is, I believe, when they will look at the place in question. Basically, all's fair until you get caught. Not the best way to do things, but that’s the way it happens. The law is enforceable right now. I'm not sure who one must report violators to, though. CPSC or something else?

[Former_Member]

How can you tell by looking at something that it has lead in it?

[Former_Member]

In the General Public, and even Retailers seem completely unaware of the law, seems to be only a Hot Topic here on Etsy. I have gone so far as to ask Managers of Childrens Clothing Stores about the Law..they were all clueless.
Go figure..seems to be a well kept secret..regarding Clothing..
Toys, & Motorbikes get all the Press

[SealandStringStudio]

In my area, the only places that seem to take the law seriously are the thrift stores. All of my favorite shops have done away with toys and games. I tried to donate a Playmobil Nativity set, in its original box, and it was declined.

They do still sell kids clothes, so I guess it's not 100% compliance, but it's a harsh blow when you have a biz that recycles game parts.

[FayeMaloneDesigns]

I agree with sugarandspice, you can't tell that something has lead in it just by looking.

Painted metal buttons may very well pass lead tests, lead doesn't make things glow in the dark or give off an odor. Don't buy the line that everything made before this law was lead laden and deadly. Far from it.

Only those things manufacturered after the middle of aug 09, need labeling. Retailers order their products far far in advance of the seasons.

And the labels don't have to follow a certain format. Only the required information needs to be on the label, and it can very well be in a code that most of us wouldn't be able to decipher.

[WeBlingItOnBoutique]

I say there will never be the funding to make this happen. As you can see Walmart just gets a slap on the wrist every time they do it and Disney just claims they did not know. I think the end result of this will be that other crafters will turn in crafters which I feel is a huge shame.

[SunnyCatDesigns]

agreed weesewcute.

on one hand there are those of us who are working hard to make sure we are in compliance and it can be frustrating when other are not... but on the other hand SO many people don't know (me included until a couple weeks ago).

[Former_Member]

Here is a great site that has fantastic information by the Handmade Toy Alliance, -- http://www.facebook.com/ToyAlliance -- that is working with legislation to help create exceptions for handmade items. Here a list of the requested alteration. http://handmadetoyalliance.blogspot.com/2010/01/htas-recommended-changes-to-cpsia.html

Don't know about you, I'm all about making my products safe, which is why I sew everything, double stitch the ears and arms on my blankets, don't use buttons, plastic eyes, etc. But ordering phthalate testing on fabric seems ridiculous, and if it is so required should be done by the manufacturers and label accordingly (just as non-fire retardant fabric is for children's sleepwear).

[WeeEssentials]

There are only about 100 enforcers for all the laws that fall under the CSPC. About a year ago, right after they delayed the enforcement of the third party testing requirements, when interviewed, CSPC officials said they'd be going after the worst threats with the greatest scope. So basically, unless you are Mattel or Hasbro they'll turn a blind eye. So if you don't comply, you won't be legal, but unless a lot of people complain about your products making them sick, nothing is going to happen.

It's frustrating - like someone said back then - "I don't want to be told no one will catch me. I want to be legal."

AND...if they do decide to use you as an example, your life and livelyhood would quickly go south. They may say they won't come after you out of the side of their mouth, but there's no guarantee in that.

[mouchette]

I seriously doubt the will ever be capable of "policing" this. Too much crap and there can never be enough enforcers.

[Former_Member]

I'm SO new to this whole thing that it just terrifies me to make anything for children.
I like making tag blankets, no buttons, just fabric and some ribbon. I dont understand what I'm supposed to do to check to make sure they are 100% safe? I'm beyond obsessed with double stitching and I never use anything that could detach and be choked on...
I have no idea if thats good enough or if i should be doing something different. I've tried reading the websites, but I have been very lost on them. I'm scared to comment on posts on here for fear of people jumping at me because i dont know the rules!
Its all so confusing!

[Former_Member]

my point was, i'm considering halting the making of baby things too :0(

[Former_Member]

Yep I was wandering the same thing. I have stopped making jewelry for children because of this.

But yet everywhere I go I see things that are not labeled and don't seem to be in compliance.

The shop owner at the store I sell at even did not know about this. She just buys things to resell, she does this blindly, not knowing if it is good for people or not. It is assumed that is selling, it is good.

I informed her about it and she knew nothing of it.

[Former_Member]

This issue lacks so much concrete information that it is difficult to determine what needs to be done.

For lead test, fabric has been considered exempt from test so taggy blankets and similar should be ok, assuming there are no zippers, snaps, etc on them.

I ran across this piece of information which really seems to sum up the issues with those of us who use fabric, non plastic parts, in making baby blankets and toys with respect to phthalates.

There is a push to define what is reasonable for people to test, ie why test polyester fabric when it is not known to carry phthalates and more the point why have individual component testing.

As of present the following items are not known to carry phthalates:

* unfinished metal
* ordinary fabrics and yarns made from natural and synthetic fibers like polyester, nylon, acrylic, cotton, wool, etc.
* polyethylene, polypropylene, and polyolefin
* silicone rubber
* natural latex
* mineral products such as play sand, glass, and crystal

Therefore there is a push to have these items excluded from phthalate testing.

I would suggest, and it is what I am doing presently, is start contacting your suppliers for confirmation CPSIA compliance. If you use a certain brand of ribbon, contact that company and get their testing on that product. I've learned that this is very slow going and information is not very available. But the more of us asking for such information the more and more suppliers will get used to handing it out.

Additionally there's a good thread in the forums presently about compiling a list of manufacturers that are compliant.

In a nutshell - don't close your shop - there's no reason to at this point

[Former_Member]

sorry forgot to post the link reference above - http://www.cpsc.gov/library/foia/foia09/brief/componentpolicy.pdf

[Former_Member]

The way I see it, policing this silly law will be years in the making...it would have to be proven that someone knowingly is/was selling items that have
over the limit levels of hazardous materials. The home crafter is not going to be targeted since the original intent of this law was to control the large companies but due to lack of intelligent writers, the language used in the law leaves it wide open for encompassing anyone & everyone...the debate over this law will go on & on & on ....

[Former_Member]

VandysVarietyShoppe
VandysVarietyShoppe says:
The way I see it, policing this silly law will be years in the making
----------------------------------
I personally don't see the law as silly. If I am buying something for my children I want it to be safe whether it was made by a big or small company. Sorry but my childrens safety trumps all else for me :)

[Former_Member]

The silliness is not that the laws promote the removal of dangerous chemicals from our children's products, but that the legislation is written almost assuming that the creator of the object is also the manufacturer of the raw goods going into that product.

ie if I'm making baby clothes with zippers/snaps I am ultimately responsible for the lead content in those zippers/snaps and not the company who actually made them. It creates a lot of test redundancy in production line.

[BikiniSandi]

When I first started reading this a year or so ago, I read somewhere in all the government phamplhets concerning small businesses such as ours, the government will rely on unpaid informants to know who is not in compliance. In the governments experience, these informants are usually people that have been turned in by someone else or adversely affected in some way by the non-compliance.

So unless you get ratted out by some unknown person, you may never have to worry about it. Of course, I wouldn't want to be the one that made the item that ended up with a child dying. They will make the effort to track you down and prosecute you for that.

The risk is there. We have the list of known hazards. Its up to each one of us to decide what to do with that knowledge.

[Former_Member]

There's a stay of enforcement until February, 2011. In theory that's to give everyone time to be in compliance, but I think it's also so they have to time to work out some kind of workable system of testing & follow through.

I think it's interesting that in some of the other threads here lately w/ links to news stories- there were a few about cadmium in children's jewelry and one about lead in handbags and purses- that resulted in product recalls and/or legal action, the testing was done by independent consumer watchdog organizations and not by any government agency. As long as this issue stays visible, our hopelessly inept government might just get all the help they need to police this silly law.


waterfallcrafts says:
I have basically quit making children's items because of all these changes but yet in the market place where I have my store they keep selling everything and anything that is not in compliance. Junk from China that is most definitely not in compliance...
..........

How do you know they're not in compliance? Just curious because I'm assuming it's not just because they're from China. ...right? Pretty much everything compliant is also coming from China, and it's the American companies importing it all that are responsible for the content. So did you test them?


BBsForBabies says:
For lead test, fabric has been considered exempt from test so taggy blankets and similar should be ok, assuming there are no zippers, snaps, etc on them.
....As of present the following items are not known to carry phthalates:
* ordinary fabrics and yarns made from natural and synthetic fibers like polyester, nylon, acrylic, cotton, wool, etc.
* polyethylene, polypropylene, and polyolefin
...Therefore there is a push to have these items excluded from phthalate testing.
.........

Whole different issue, but just 'cause I've seen it here in the forums a lot- you might want to check for patents on the taggy blankets. (Depending on what you mean by taggy blanket.)

for whatever it's worth...
Where I work, we manufacture totes, backpacks & other heavy-duty fabric items, most of our canvas is made from PVC (polyvinyl chloride.) It contains phthalates. There is canvas made from PP (polypropylene) that doesn't. We have to use that on all children's product. It's a lot pricier than PVC. And to the untrained eye, it's absolutely identical.
When advertised to consumers, they're both sometimes referred to as polyester, which has kind of become a generic word for synthetic fabric. Mostly because people only seem willing to accept that something is either cotton OR it's polyester. :-) Maybe consumers are becoming more savvy after all this, I don't know. it's not something most people would ever take notice of, I think.

If more people use the PP stuff, maybe the price will come down. that would be cool.

[Former_Member]

The "silly" aspect of this law is in the lack of intelligence by those people responsible for writing this law in first place since they themselves cannot agree upon its interpretation... which will now take years to cipher and re-work so that everyone can understand. This whole law is not about children's safety..it's about control since it's a reactionary piece of legislation to curtail those hazardous products that for years the country allowed to be made & enter the country without enforcing the already existing hazardous materials guidelines.

[mouchette]

Well said Vandy. Right on the mark.

The idea of the law is not silly... it's just that the bill that has been thrown in our laps is impossible to interpret clearly, and seems to be literally impossible to actually monitor or police.

I was walking around the wholesale toy district of Los Angeles a few months ago. Millions and millions of toys fresh off the boats at Long Beach Harbor. Just one look told me that to police this one major point of distribution would take 100's of enforcers working round the clock. 1000's of new containers of toys come in every day. The sheer volume of objects to be inspected is unmanageable by any means we have at present. It's just not going to happen. I'm certain they will have to rely on snitches basically ratting out people they want to bust, or consumers themselves reporting suspicious items... so we are back where we were before the bill.

It's easier to monitor the US mom-and-pop sellers who sell at craft shows and such, so ultimately the people that are the most likely to be in compliance are going to get messed with the most. Very sad.

[happywhosits]

The way the law is written, state attorney generals can also prosecute offenders. And in some states, they probably will.

Eileen...

[Former_Member]

Just remember all you need to be out of compliance is to not have all the proper labels on a product or the label done improperly. As to the purported number of field inspectors 100 was the pre-CPSIA amount and one subsection of the CSPIA was to increase their #s every year until they CPSC felt that there are enough to properly enforce this law or when Congress or the House felt there are enough and cuts funding for new hires. Anybody can with justification report an item to the CPSC for not following any part of the CPSIA or any other CPSC law or regulation. The field inspectors are not the ones that will follow up on the outside reports but clerks at the main CPSC will and if there is an over load of reports I don't doubt that they would turn over the investigation down to state or county levels if need be.

I like to think of the CPSIA as being a lot like the laws and regulations of the road. Many will break those laws thinking they won't be caught and fined because there's not enough police for the "minor" infactions, but you never know till you get a notice & fine that a traffic camera snapped your pic for nosing over a walkway on the red. Just like a stop sign on the road you don't have a police officer at everyone of them in your town to enforce the fines that could be given for not stoping there, but you do hope that motorists will still respect the law that that the sign represents and stop there for the safety of others before proceeding.