Just an example of how lead can be anywhere...

[#1]

I've been thinking a lot about this law lately -- not just its implications on small businesses like myself, but also the public policy that should be in place.

I, personally, feel the law has valid intent -- whether or not we grew up with lead and came out fine, the fact is that a lot of other children did not. I've heard some argue that a little lead isn't that bad and that they were fine... I disagree. There are quite a few smokers who don't develop lung cancer, but you won't hear people out there saying that a few cigarettes are ok or a little second-hand smoke is alright.

You want to hear a sad story?

A neighbor moved in a few months ago from a subdivision nearby. I saw a boy playing in her yard, so I went over to introduce myself and my son. She invited me inside and our two toddlers played while we had some coffee and introduced ourselves. Her son is around six months younger than my son and she explained that the reason they moved was that her son was diagnosed with lead poisoning.

Lead poisoning? From what?

From the tiles in her home. Apparently, the very act of her toddler dragging his blankie across the floor or lying on the floor, then putting his blankie/thumb in his mouth was enough to cause the lead poisoning (through ingestion). Only a very small amount of lead is necessary for irreversible problems to present themselves -- neurological defects, cardiovascular problems, etc.

Now, by saying that I'm not implying I support the law in its current form... It's to say that we really should take responsibility for this and buy only from suppliers who test, especially the imports from other countries. I was just reading how synthetic dyes from other countries have lead in them because they are cheaper to produce -- these dyes are used in the production of fabric. Especially in light of this, I feel it's the suppliers *responsibility* to test.

Also, if you have children... ask questions. Going to install tile? Ask the producer if their tile has lead in it -- do not assume that lead isn't in the tile, as it could have been imported from another country. Tile companies don't have to tell you if their item has lead in it until you ask them.

The last thing I'd ever want is to see a child damaged for the rest of their life because of lead poisoning, something that is ridiculously preventable.

Jen

Who is sad because of this and her aunt passing away.

[Former_Member]

Have an Aunt who is allergic to Red (#40?) dye. What a sad childhood!! That crap is in EVERYthing.

The only reason why those dyes are in food products are to make them more commercially 'pretty' for the consumer. They're not necessary. They're unnecessary additives which are not natural.

Except for the carmine which is used for dye. Now that's natural. What can be more natural than crushed bugs?

[Former_Member]

Just stop buying chinese made stuff for the kids to put into their mouths. My kids did not put things into their mouth once it hit the floor, I made sure to teach them that. I cringe whenever I see those videos where people, yes even adults, pick things up of the ground and eat it or share it with a pet. Gross, animals do lick their butts!!! My daughter dropped her paci and I did not get it before she put it in her mouth, she never put it in her mouth once it hit the floor again. You should have seen the face she made. If they would still make the toys over here this would not have been an issue.
Rant over. lol

[Former_Member]

*ew*

[Former_Member]

eclipse
eclipse says:
MyManyMoodz says:
That said, I do wonder why it's being deemed safe enough for my kids over 12 and myself to have these untested products in our homes and on our possesions.
....

I think it's due to body weight and maybe the metabolism of children too- the smaller the child, the less it takes to reach a toxic level. Certainly lead can kill a full grown man too but it takes lot more of it.
------

I also think it has to do with their physical and mental development. Not that when they get to the teen years they stop developing, but it is much more pronounced - especially the brain and all - in the younger years.

[Former_Member]

http://www.theribboncarnival.com/
they have alot of info on this and i also have messaged them for a cert.

[Former_Member]

There is a great book out called "The Toxic Sandbox" which talks about lead, mercury, phalates and many other harmful items that we and our kids encounter everyday. The author also talks about things you can do to protect your kids from all these items, as best you can. When I read it I thought one of the saddest and most frustrating bits of information was that the government didn't even outlaw lead until 1978 and only for residential use. They can still use it on roads and stuff. The rest of the world banned lead paint long before. The book is by Libby McDonald and she has a website too. Just thought I'd share.

[Former_Member]

That is sad and I am sorry about your Aunt too Jen

[Former_Member]

TerraScents says:

Except for the carmine which is used for dye. Now that's natural. What can be more natural than crushed bugs?

*************
ew.

I am allergic to all sorts of interesting and odd things, but chemicals in store bought soaps and make-up is a biggie. Red dye is another (no flamin' hot cheet-oes for me), certain perfumes, pine trees and sap and pine cones and pine nuts (weird), so I really understand testing and knowing what is hazardous to one's health especially children.

I'm pretty much no longer making kids stuff, just selling off what I have.

[Former_Member]

I guess the point is that we cannot all have laws outlawing things that are injurious to some and not to others. Everything would be illegal. We just have to accept our limitations and avoid those things as best we can.

[Former_Member]

Grandmasgirl says:

"just read recently where a lady has a problem even with the trace amounts of heavy metals used in dyes such as zinc, chromium, lead, copper, mercury, and nickel. Her liver will absolutely not tolerate any amount of these metals at all.

"Garment finishes for wrinkle-free, stain resistant, flame retardant, anti-fungal, anti-bacterial, anti-static, odor-resistant, permanent-press, non-shrink, softening agents, and the other easy care treatments that are applied to new clothing can be especially harmful for people with chemical sensitivities … which is basically all of us – it is just the degree of sensitivity that varies"

_____________________________________

I understand the point that many are making but in the final analysis one has to draw the line somewhere. Don't we need zinc to live?

We need to remember that as human beings we are ALL born to eventually die. Now we don't want to go too soon BUT it will happen so I'm beginning to think that all of the hysteria that we go through regarding safety in our country is nothing more than an extension of the fear that we have about death and dying in our culture---our fixation with youth is also an offshoot of this.

A person can eat nothing but organic free range raised vegetarian peat moss oat wheat grass muffins, drink nothing more caustic than 100% pomegranate acai juice, run 10 miles, never smoke, never overindulge,eat all their veggies, practice safe sex with only one partner,always use a crosswalk, only drink bottled water, build a zen garden, recycle,never drive, and guess what---they're still going to die. You know there was a time when death and dying were viewed with a much more balanced point of view...no one wanted either BUT because it happened so much, it was just a part of life. Times were hard back then---now times are not so hard. We have vaccines and antibiotics. Instead of relishing our much better standard of living than previous generations, we seem to now have become fixated on becoming invincible. I'm not advocating dying early or not taking a fair amount of precautions but I certainly think a balanced perspective is necessary.

[Former_Member]

Thank you for mentioning this. I have two small children and we are getting ready to start house shopping. I know the effects of lead poisoning can be devastating and I have made a mental to note to ask!
There are also strips you can buy (hardware stores, etc) that will test lead by placing the strip on the item in question, which is good for smaller household items.
I'm sorry to hear about all of that! It makes me so sad to hear about a child being injured or getting sick :(

[Former_Member]

MyManyMoodz says:
That said, I do wonder why it's being deemed safe enough for my kids over 12 and myself to have these untested products in our homes and on our possesions.

Personally, I think it's overprotectionism- it would have made more sense to limit the law to children 6 and under.

[Former_Member]

I know a person who was lead poisoned, a 40 something union ironworker.

I don't think banning harmful substances is "over" anything.

I think regulating the wrong people/places is the problem.

[Former_Member]

I don't mean to sound...well...mean:

but..uhh.. an ironworker who was exposed to dangerous chemicals...shocking!

Kind of shocking like a coalminer with black lung...a nuclear plant worker with radiation poisoning. Here's a new term for the day: occupational hazards. Unless that person was sold into ironwork slavery at the tender age of 6...

We're talking about babies whose parents purchased more than likely expensive homes in suburbia and who were exposed to lead as a result of the tiling in that home(which also was probably expensive--not that money is a protection, but often we believe that in terms of products, we're doing the best by buying the best)...the baby was not smelting anything. The baby was not working in any refineries. When we start equating babies in supposedly non-hazardous environments with 40 something union ironworkers all in an attempt to make a point------That's called overprotectionism.

-----sidenote: what is up with all of these folk who know folk? strange. In regards to the entire issue, I keep hearing the equivalent of "I had a third cousin four times removed whose aunt's stepmother's oldest brother's girlfriend's sister's hairdresser..."yeah. okay.----

[Former_Member]

Ok, yep.

Anything done to eliminate lead over the last 25 years is a waste.
In fact, why not dismantle OSHA. You're gonna die someday. Buy your kid some ZOTS.

[Former_Member]

Hahaha, zots!

That was good. ah, a little witty repartee...quite funny..Okay. My husband works in a shipyard as a machinist. He knows there is a risk. His work coveralls are not allowed to come in the house. He takes a shower as soon as he comes in---why? Because even though the yard has all types of precautionary safety info spread around and even has a program to support worker safety, the fact is: its still a shipyard. There's just no getting around that. He's building naval ships and oil tankers. When he was first hired, they gave him an aspirator mask as part of his uniform...he stopped wearing it after the first few weeks, truth is none of the thousands of guys that work there wear them.

He enjoys his work and his work pays well but I still don't want him to be in it until he retires because there are risks: its a shipyard. He has asthma---did I mention its a shipyard? Plain and simple even with the best lungs going, he's going to be exposed to things in a greater way than a guy behind a desk sitting in some building.

[Former_Member]

My cousin's child got lead poisoning from paint flaking off his ceiling and wall in their apartment and landing in his crib. He will never be like other children his age. It is awful.

[Former_Member]

So you're saying that it's okay for the worker to be exposed to asbestos, lead, etc? Why is that? Oops your fault for needing a job to feed your family?

[Former_Member]

It seems to me that it's "acceptable" for blue collar workers to get exposed to toxins at work. And for it to be "sissyish" to use safety equipment and safety procedures.

That's unfortunate ... it's not necessary.

I've worked in environments that had serious toxins before ... I'm grateful that the organisations i was working in had a more enlightened attitude ... they had procedures and safety equipment in place so that workers weren't exposed. Safety and avoiding contamination was a huge deal, not some sissyish rule everybody ignored.

[Former_Member]

I am going to say this & I really hope no one takes it in a wrong way - Please!

The whole thing is that you really can never be so sure of anything.
Like I mentioned in another thread:
I am sure there is a reason for it all -
I mean while there are some of us that can be positively sure that the stuff we make is certainly lead free, smoke free, pet free, or what ever -
How can one be for SURE that this is true for EVERY household? Even if they think & say it is.

It's the same reason there are seat belt, helmet, car insurance laws. & why they put warning labels on Flannel Fabrics, or on food made with Peanuts, or even Fake Christmas Trees. And it's sad to say that I am sure they may be putting child warning labels on Washing Machines now too!

I don't like this situation either, but what can we do, except try our best to keep our Loved Ones as safe as we can.
Wouldn't you agree?

[Former_Member]

Yes, people are getting poisoned from the glaze in tiles, from paint in the house, from jewelry charms, but does anyone know anyone who got lead poisoning from wearing washed clothing without having a genetic disorder to start with? They want government certified CLOTHING. Why? Because we all need to wear clothing and the government needs revenue. They can prey on irrational fear (lead in t-shirts) just as they have fed quite gluttonously on global warming.

[Former_Member]

While I appreciate the danger of lead, asbestos, etc, what I don't appreciate is the government passing such a broad, unenforceable piece of legislation.

I think all of this discussion is great.

AEH.