Confused with SEO!

[Former_Member]

Re-working my SEO, pl. take a look and any help will be appreciated!

For example, I have tried my best with this listing:
https://www.etsy.com/listing/97168817/wooden-toys-animals-vintage-collectibles

1. Titles - to use dots, hyphens, commas or just a bunch of descriptive keywords?

2. Title - If the item is Vintage collectible and Vintage toy, should I use
"Vintage - Toy - Collectibles" or "Vintage Toys - Vintage Collectibles"

2. Seen lots of listings where the (keyword rich) title is just copy-pasted in the first two lines of the description. Good or bad idea?

3. Tags: ("Miniature figurine", "Miniature Toys" ) or ("Miniature", "Figurine", "Toys") ?
I mean should each of the tags be more descriptive of the item or more generic?

4. Finally, What should I improve in this listing for better SEO?

Thanks so much! :)

[elainesgems]

If I was looking for this item I would probably type in vintage wooden toys or vintage wooden animals. You could try using Google AdWords for tag ideas.
https://adwords.google.com/o/Targeting/Explorer?__c=1000000000&__u=1000000000&ideaRequestType=KEYWOR...

[Former_Member]

Just checked out your link Elaine and it gave me a few ideas that I didn't think of to add to my tags! Thank you!!

[Former_Member]

Phrases are better than single words, rarely does anyone search for just figurine. As for titles, I play around with mine A LOT. I'd probably start my title with the word "vintage" only because that is the most descriptive, then follow it with "wooden animal toys".

Good luck.

[UrbanPearlStudio]

Gaurie, SEO is impossible to master and it would take a lifetime to do so. The search engines keep changing to ensure the 'pros' aren't always on top and it gives the little guys the same opportunity.

Here is a great start - an APP make for Etsy Shops - it's a tune up type program that will give your shop a grade and then allow you to modify on the spot and offer all sorts of hints along the way

http://etsyshoptimizer.com/

Every SEO guide tells you to use keywords just like as if you were buying the item. What words would you plug in to Google.

This is just a teeeeny tiny bit of info but the shoptomizer will at least let you know where you should start. Hope it helps.

[Former_Member]

There is a great team here on Etsy that helps folks get started on SEO
SEO Team

I suggest joining them and asking for help. They will have info on titles, tags and the attempt to not piss off google. :)

[Former_Member]

that shoptimizer is amazing! I am using it right now! thanks for the tip.

[Former_Member]

ditto on Hayley. Shoptimizer ROCKS!! so glad I read this thread for that tip.

[Former_Member]

I love shoptimizer, I used it the first time yesterday and hit A for my shop without any work which made me super proud I'd figured out this stupid SEO thing.

I found these articles and forum posts helpful when I was working on this. Although I admit, if I forget that it's "SEO" I can be incredibly relevant in my listings. The word "SEO" can make me panic, the idea of "relevancy" I can totally understand.

http://www.etsy.com/teams/7718/site-help/discuss/9060981/page/1
http://www.etsy.com/help/article/247
http://www.etsy.com/teams/11352/relevancy-and-seo-for-all-etsy-shops/discuss/10406495/

[Former_Member]

I tried the shoptimizer but I don't really get it. It's telling me that I have straight A's for my shop and products - which is nice - but my only failings are in SEO.

and when you click into "Fix it" to see how you can improve, all it says is that my titles and descriptions are too long. They want me down to 66 character. Uhhh I don't think I could say anything at all useful in ONLY 66 characters?

It doesn't have ANY suggestions for me, apart from that. Not very helpful.

[Former_Member]

"They want me down to 66 character."

This is what I learned in marketing and journalism, people read the first three sentences. That's it. In those first three sentences they want, "what is it, how does it work, and why do I want it". Anything past that is a back story and isn't always read. So what it probably is saying to you is, what's in the first three sentences about your product? Does it cover succinctly what your item is?

The optimizer isn't perfect, some listings need a lot of words, and it isn't a human who can grade it, it's going based on numbers and algorithms. You've got to figure out for yourself how to use what it's telling you for your listings.

[Former_Member]

That's the thing - that was its ONLY suggestion on what I can improve. That I make things shorter.

I guess that IS a suggestion in and of itself - you can always be more concise... But I dunno, I guess I was hoping for more helpful information other than "you're too long-winded"

Oh well.. I guess I can take solace in the fact that otherwise I have an A+ shop with B- SEO. Time to work on paring things down to 66 measly characters. That's like a quarter of a Tweet!

[Former_Member]

Any ideas on SEO for art? It's so subjective that I find it really hard to title my pieces sensibly. Or, at least, sensible for search.

[Former_Member]

Tried the optimizer thing....
Not very impressed. LOL
For those having issues with SEO (titles and tags) I would highly recommend the SEO team. They will look at an actual listing and go over how to use google adwords to find the right words for your product.

This app thing seems to be only looking at when things were posted (my policy page gets an F based only on when it was updated) and how long each listing/title is. Doesn't seem to read the actual material, just tell you whether you have enough to too much.

[UrbanPearlStudio]

Maggie, I hope this helps - I have struggled with this and constantly do tests

the idea that the title should be 66 or less characters really is key. You are supposed to be giving a few keywords and then the real meat of the SEO is in your description. Make sure it has the same keywords (and in clusters like a phrase if possible) so the search engines see revelancy and repeat of those words/phrases.

I'm using this listing of your to show you (way cute item by the way!!)
http://www.etsy.com/listing/93281826/navy-blue-crystal-headband-crochet

Here is your title
Navy blue crystal headband - Crochet stretch headband / ear warmer with powder blue flower applique and crystal button

Blue Flowered Croched Stretch Headband

This is your description
Another original design by Beach Plum Cottage! I only had a handful of these exclusive and luxurious crystal buttons, so chances are - you will never see its equal! Truly makes this head band truly one of a kind.

Headband / ear warmer measures approximately 22" around and 3" wide and is adorned with a two color blue flower applique and crystal button. Light and breezy for summer, but still warm and sturdy enough for fall! Goes with a variety of hairstyles and outfits.

What you might look at, what are you saying that is most important to the buyer AKA what are they looking for, so you might mix up your details sort of like this

Adorable handmade navy blue croched stretch headband with gorgeous two toned blue flower applique adorned with a crystal button.

The headband / ear warmer measures approximately 22" around and 3" wide and it light and breezy for summer, but still warm and sturdy enough for fall! Goes with a variety of hairstyles and outfits.

Another original design by Beach Plum Cottage! I only had a handful of these exclusive and luxurious crystal buttons, so chances are - you will never see its equal! Truly makes this head band truly one of a kind.

Does that help you - think like the buyer that will most likely plug in to Google, blue stretch headband with flower.

I am struggling with this so much and read anything and everything I can pick up on SEO. Wish I had a magic wand!

[Former_Member]

The SEO and Relevancy team is great, but they make you brainstorm your own keywords and stuff before you post a listing for critique. A lot of people just go join there expecting for people to solve their problems for them. Just a word of warning, this takes a bit of research on your own, but Dawn is right - the SEO team is really helpful if you're willing to put in some time.

Thanks so much UrbanPearl! Like you said "Think like a buyer" - this is key. It becomes very hard for us as sellers sometimes to think outside our craft, and think in terms of what a buyer would search for. I am ALWAYS looking for more help in this, so thanks very much for your input :)

[UrbanPearlStudio]

You are most welcome! Just snooped around your shop - great items and amazing photos.

[Former_Member]

Yup, they do make you work on it... and others help too.
But doing the work with guidance can help a ton when you need to redo your whole shop. :)
I just had my first sale thru a google search/find so pretty sure the changes are finally starting to pay off. I work on listings as I post them or have to renew them. Now to get better are marketing :)

[Former_Member]

Urban, I have to chuckle, you flipped Maggie's listing around *exactly* the same way I would have, its back the that first three sentences thing, (hey, wonder if this is where that stupid "three first words" myth came from??) the first, and crucial part to the listing, and then the blurb about Maggie and her work below.

And yes, the SEO team is great, and yes, you have to put work into you own listing, and there isn't much hand holding, but its teaching you to do your best and then get help.

[Former_Member]

Cooooool! I would never thought of using "Google AdWords" myself. Gonna play with new titles and tags too. Thanks for sharing.

[LoopsAndLines]

I tried the Shoptimizer too and just ignored that my shop title and descriptions were too long. I figured if my important words were in the first #, I was good.

Good links above. This one I have bookmarked so I can refer to it. Step by step, what to do, additional links included, organized from easy to implement to more difficult.

http://etsymentors.blogspot.com/p/critique-your-own-shop.html

[Former_Member]

Thank you for the link, Urban Pearl Studio! Very useful. : )